I am justifying? Oh no you don't. I am trying to make sense of a claim from antoher poster that "liberal" bias is profitable for the corporations that own our media. You claimed that you could live with that "liberal bias for profit" model as long as no talking heads pretended to be actual journalists. I then tried to find out from you what form you suggest that mea culpa might take.

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A nation of slaves is always prepared to applaud the clemency of their master who, in the abuse of absolute power, does not proceed to the utmost extremes of injustice and oppression.
Edward Gibbon

Why did you claim there is a liberal bias and it's because that's what the people want? Why did you then claim people want conservative bias? And why did you then decide there is no reason at all for the liberal bias? That's one hell of a map and compass you've got there - it's got you spinning in a circle.

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A nation of slaves is always prepared to applaud the clemency of their master who, in the abuse of absolute power, does not proceed to the utmost extremes of injustice and oppression.
Edward Gibbon

Read my five-word post again and tell me where I claimed anything other than "when it sells, you bet." It's only five words, so it shouldn't be too taxing for you.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

The American media is being degraded not because of some corporate conspiracy or because of some inherent ideological disposition, but rather because info-tainment is something that viewers are demanding. Furthermore, this increasing dependency on 30-second-sound bytes and appealing graphics has made the media (and, in effect, the public's perceptions of their government) much more pliable. When the line between news and entertainment is blurred, depth and content are inevitably sacrificed. This is certainly a cause for concern-after all, the media serves as the medium through which most people evaluate the actions of their government. People need to be more conscientious of their choices as consumers of information.

All true. But even more important (IMO) is that the "star" status that is bestowed on TV "journalists" means they have more in common with the powerful people they are supposed to cover than they do with the people they are reporting to. Add to that the threat of being cut off from the ability to talk to the politicians if they ask hard questions and you have a situation where the cozy relationship between TV news people and politicians prevents any real journalism from taking place.

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A nation of slaves is always prepared to applaud the clemency of their master who, in the abuse of absolute power, does not proceed to the utmost extremes of injustice and oppression.
Edward Gibbon

I read and understood your post. But thank you so much for your concern that I not tax my intellect decoding your "point"

Your statement was in response to my post suggesting sarcastically that the mega corporations who own our media are known for their left wing views. Your statement implies those corporations display a liberal bias because "it sells". Things that sell do so because people want to buy them. That means the corporations are displaying a liberal bias because that is what the people want to buy. Perfectly clear. No problem.

Trouble is you then went on to say in your next post that people really don't want to buy liberal bias - they want to buy conservative bias. And when I pointed out you can't claim one thing in one post and the exact opposite in the next you answered that those for-profit companies forced that liberal bias on consumers even thought they didn't want it. But for no apparent reason. No wonder you thought I might have trouble keeping up.

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A nation of slaves is always prepared to applaud the clemency of their master who, in the abuse of absolute power, does not proceed to the utmost extremes of injustice and oppression.
Edward Gibbon

These are all problems which are not new. But remember that though politicians and journalists do need each other, it is also true that journalists are competing in a free market for information that spans several mediums. One reaction to this growing sensationalism in the television news is that people are turning to the internet more as a source of information. Politicians are also competing against each other for support, so you could also say that that generates inherent demand for an alternative view. I think the ingredients for 'real' journalism will be around as long as the market for news remains relatively unfettered.

I guess that makes your inference of my five-word post inaccurate.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

I must have overlooked all those corporations who fight for safety and health regulations and keep forcing more money and better working conditions on their workers. And all that offshoring of jobs - that's not a lack of caring for american workers I'm seeing - it's an overabundance of caring for third world workers.

The instructions given by ownership and mgmt to workers is seldom a matter of public knowledge unless laws are broken and somebody gets caught. The idea that anyone would own a for-profit business and allow the employees to dictate the public message of that business seems impossible to me. These are not companies who got into news because of some impulse to serve the public good or because it's a family tradition (except, obviously, the sulzbergers who recently gave long time family friend and PNAC head bill kristol a spot on the ed page). These are for-profit corporations. That means they control their product to obtain the largest possible return. And that means if there is any political bias, it is there either because it is profitable (meaning most consumers want bias) or because that suits the other wide ranging business interests of those corporations. And those other business interests include eliminating regulation and keeping workers relatively powerless. Positions traditionally more closely identified with republicans and conservatives than with democrats and liberals.

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A nation of slaves is always prepared to applaud the clemency of their master who, in the abuse of absolute power, does not proceed to the utmost extremes of injustice and oppression.
Edward Gibbon

Go ahead then and explain it for this poor guy who is just too stupid to understand you.

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A nation of slaves is always prepared to applaud the clemency of their master who, in the abuse of absolute power, does not proceed to the utmost extremes of injustice and oppression.
Edward Gibbon

OK. The initial inference you drew from a simple five-word post is inaccurate. Easy solution.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

I wish I could be so sanguine. The power of politicians and the corporations who own our media are a formidable obstacle to any "real" journalism. I know the internet makes possible alot of news sources that were impossible before. But I am afraid that most people will continue to get their information from a relatively monolithic structure of corporate owned politicians and news sources for many years to come. The lack of corporate or government control over the internet is at least partly a temporary condition brought on by a misunderstanding of its possible power and the owners of broadcast and cable networks as well as conservative politicians may very well get a better grip on it as time goes by.

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A nation of slaves is always prepared to applaud the clemency of their master who, in the abuse of absolute power, does not proceed to the utmost extremes of injustice and oppression.
Edward Gibbon

Please tell me what you meant by that remark that I am too stupid to grasp.

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A nation of slaves is always prepared to applaud the clemency of their master who, in the abuse of absolute power, does not proceed to the utmost extremes of injustice and oppression.
Edward Gibbon

OK. The first three words, "when it sells", make a qualifying phrase. If that qualifying phrase is true, by rule, the subsequent phrase, "you bet", becomes true.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

Sorry for my response delay...I am falling behind. At any rate, your idea of the media as 'monolithic' is excessively simplistic. As I mentioned before, both journalists and politicians are in constant competition with each other, thanks to the values of free speech and checks and balances. And, technology has increased the ability of people to publish alternate opinions. Your point about the media and moneyed interests is well taken; however, don't take my assertion that a market is only as good as its consumers (and a democracy is only as good as the citizens within it) for excessive optimism.