Doesn't that sound true? The right wing media has been eager to promote that John McCain is "more experienced" to lead on issues of national security. This is reflected in recent polling numbers. Even in polls where Obama leads by 5-10 points voters believe, overwhelmingly that McCain would keep America safe.

Yet take this exchange between MSNBC "liberal" journalists and Ret. General Wesley Clarke who calmly, rational explanation of why McCain actually DOESN'T have serious military experience. Watch as the supposed "liberal media" attempts to defend McCain.
It gets worse,

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Yesterday, John McCain actually said that if he’s president he’ll take on, and I quote, 'the old boys’ network in Washington.' I’m not making this up. This is somebody been in Congress for 26 years, who put seven of the most powerful Washington lobbyists in charge of his campaign. And now he tells us that he’s the one who’s gonna take on the old boys' network,” he said. “In the McCain campaign that’s called a staff meeting!- Obama, 9/17/2008

Im confused. Are you trying to prove that the media isnt liberal, or that the media is conservative, or that John McCain does or doesnt have military experience, or that he does or doesnt have military leadership experience? And Morning Joe? Thats the best you can do?

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http://www.fairtax.org

Elminate all taxes on income and replace with a national sales tax.

and McC never got fired for screwing up a command.

Im trying to disupt the myth that John McCain somehow is more prepared for military leadership than anyone else. I think Clarke makes some good points. However he's a lone voice in the media. It's accepted as fact that McCain somehow just inherently has national security credentials. What are those again?

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Yesterday, John McCain actually said that if he’s president he’ll take on, and I quote, 'the old boys’ network in Washington.' I’m not making this up. This is somebody been in Congress for 26 years, who put seven of the most powerful Washington lobbyists in charge of his campaign. And now he tells us that he’s the one who’s gonna take on the old boys' network,” he said. “In the McCain campaign that’s called a staff meeting!- Obama, 9/17/2008

he's only runing against BHO. "anyone" else need not be shown.

McCain indisputably has more military leadership experience that Obama.

But is this relevant? Not really, IMHO. The JCS folks are there to provide that experience, not the President.

Matt

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De duobus malis, minus est semper eligendum

I'd say thats right to a large extent, he was a spilot, a junior officer. Does he have the military experience of a Clarke, Petraeus Powell no way. I think one may be missing the boat on understanding what some mean when they say he has "military" experience.

To me it means he has served, as to his service and what it implies regards his feelings afterward and how he realtes to such, for instance as he was a victim of torture, he is against it, a state of mind I, not a victim but a veteran still finds hard to understand.

Kerry served, well done, but and heres were many of you might want to sit up and listen a bit, it WAS NOT the swift boat adds per se’ that really did him in, i.e the other sailors in the grp shots etc. it was the winter soldier hearings, the lies he told at them and the dishonor he attempted to shed on the military.

Its one of those things that registers with people accross the spectrum. It speaks to Kerrys (and maybe obamas we’ll see) lack of understanding regards what people here feel on a visceral level towards the military; Kerry thought it was a winner, he could not be made to be seen as hostile to the military, he dragged it out, he thought he was going to get a free ride regarding all the crap he did in the past regarding the service, that was delusional imho.

It never occurred to him that when you attempt to pull the structure down or berate in that fashion people are going to be upset. The military in this country is one of the very few institutions across the board that is seen as truly a meritocracy sans bias, honorable, above the rest of the gov. regards political machinations and the like, AND a reflection of the country as a whole. You fuck with that at your peril, veteran or not.

Old roman saying, Juvenal I believe; “It is easier to find a witness bearing false evidence against a citizen, than it is to find one who will bear true testimony against the interest and honor of a solider”.

Soldiers raping looting in scenes reminiscent of ghengis khan? Yea well we are right back to the McClellan issue, why then especially as on Officer, did he not report these violations when they occurred? He never did have any Names, dates places..etc. Sol he was seen as jackal, true or not.

That being said McCain has been accrued military "experience" that is more of a reflection of his service and platform as a whole, the guy spent 5 1/2 years in a pow camp treated harshly etc. He understands the military mindset better than obama thats for sure, and heres the kicker;
he has been a senator or in congress for 27 years, he has heard a lot seen a lot and with his limited hands on experience can I think make a claim to be more aware or experienced regards such, but hes no Ike, or Powell thats for sure. Lie it or not people are averse to critique of soldiers and they think better of one who has served honorably and speaks well of the organization, call it patriotism blind or not, that’s a reality. And this will accrue to him the term “experienced ” ala military matters whether real or imagined.

It a loser of Obama goes there. (adding to that he DID 3 years ago call bush out regards lack of troops resources etc. this provides or adds luster to that patina of experience as well).

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Obama-e fungis nati homines....

well said, kids today have no idea on how to parse or recognize the meaning and differences between leadership and mgt.

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Obama-e fungis nati homines....

OK so we'll just run Eisenhower instead then.

What I get out of the interview with Gen. Clark is just the typical campaign negativity. He's a Democrat that supports Obama so of course he's going to campaign against McCain using whatever means necessary!

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"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Chardonnay in one hand - chocolate in the other - body thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and screaming "WOO HOO, What a Ride!"

From what I've seen many Republicans don't care about Eisenhower because he was a true conservative and warned us about the military industrial complex. A lot of Republicans have instead embraced faux conservatism which has led to all Reagan all the time and talking tough without thinking things through(McCain).

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Is our children learning? -George W. Bush

"I think—tide turning—see, as I remember—I was raised in the desert, but tides kind of—it's easy to see a tide turn—did I say those words?"—Washington, D.C., June 14, 2006

"[T]he illiteracy level of our children are appalling."—Washington, D.C., Jan. 23, 2004

Mika Brzezinski is the daughter of Zbiegniew Brzezinski. One of Mika's brothers is an adviser to Obama, her other brother is an adviser to McCain.

If you go to Mika's MY SPACE page, she has an interview with her dad on oil and the election. She claims her father is an adviser to Obama, but he corrects here and says he is only a supporter and not an adviser, Mika says o.k. and I am 10 years old again.

Classic.

So, does Mika lean towards her brother's views on politics who is an adviser to McCain, or towards her brother's views who is an adviser to Obama?

MySpace.com - Mika Brzezinski - 41 - Female - NEW YORK, New York - www.myspace.com/nbcmikabrzezinski

People are using his military experience in Vietnam as a justification that he's better on national security issues. The question then has to become, does he have any experience LEADING military operations. No. Does he have experience formulating national security policy. No. So in and of itself "experience" can't be used as an argument for McCain on national security. The media and National Security Voters should be challenging McCain on the rationale behind his national security platform rather than merely accepting because he was in the military and was tortured that somehow means he knows anything about the military.

He has flip flopped on torture and presently is in favor of Bush Administration interrogation tactics. I know it's hard to keep up with the guys flip flops, but yup, that's another one.

Not sure how Kerry became part of this discussion. However, if you think that anyone was thinking about John Kerry and the Winter soldier hearings during the swift boat controversy you are sorely mistaken. Those guys flat out lied about John Kerry. Everyone who was on the boat WITH John Kerry says they were under enemy fire. Period. Perhaps you're feeling guilty and you believed them and that's why you bring it up?

Miscalculated the willingness of veterans to lie, for months and on every channel about what happened in Vietnam? Sure I guess he did.

None of this has to do with John McCain. I was hoping you'd actually have some evidence that John McCain has experience on leading on national security. You don't.

Oh so you're applying some kind of standard to John Kerry because he didn't have the specific names of people who he saw committing atrocities. Atrocities every hsitorian of the Vietnam war knows existed and which few would discount. But you don't care at all that "swift boat" veterans lied, and lied and LIED about John Kerry. Just got on television and lied and were supported by the RNC. OK.

Can you explain how being a POW translates into qualifications to formulate national security strategies? I'm fascinated to find out.

So we're in agreement that basically people want to believe that McCain has experience simply because they want to believe it. Isn't this EXACTLY my point about Right Wing Media MYTHS. A myth is something that people "blindly" believe and will suffer no one pointing out how false it is. This is my argument, thanks for making it for me.

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Yesterday, John McCain actually said that if he’s president he’ll take on, and I quote, 'the old boys’ network in Washington.' I’m not making this up. This is somebody been in Congress for 26 years, who put seven of the most powerful Washington lobbyists in charge of his campaign. And now he tells us that he’s the one who’s gonna take on the old boys' network,” he said. “In the McCain campaign that’s called a staff meeting!- Obama, 9/17/2008

Ike was pretty middle of the road.

Im not aware of anyone saying hes more prepared than ANYONE else, but based on his credentials alone he is more prepated than Obama by a wide margin. Heres a short list.

-graduated from US Naval Acadamy
-22 years military service including naval liason to congress
-20 years service as federal congressmen including serving on armed services committee

If we compare this to many past presidents, he is indeed more prepared than they were. Also, where is this evidence that the right wing media is putting this "myth" forward?

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Elminate all taxes on income and replace with a national sales tax.