I am in awe of your amazing gallantry in defending the ever even-handed Mudwhistle. Kudos to you, Mr. Larson.

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This land was made for you and me
-Woody Guthrie

The point I made in my post wasn't regarding what Mud writes.

How many right-wing talking heads have you heard call him "B. Hussein Obama"? Personally, I've lost count. These people say there's nothing wrong with it.

My middle name is Thomas. If someone called me "S. Thomas Jones", that wouldn't register with me; it's not my name. If someone called me on the phone and said "Hi Tom!", my reply would be "Sorry, wrong number".

There's only one reason to put an emphasis on his middle name rather than his first. Unfortunately, right-wingers fail to acknowledge that Obama had absolutely nothing to do with him having the name he does.

The point I was making was, given the propensity for people on the right to do that, we shouldn't be at all surprised that Obama has made these comments.

There are plenty of reasons to not like Obama. His name shouldn't be one of them...

Not that Matt needs me to defend him, but he's taken issue with Mud on many an occasion. The even-handedness I see is not from Mud, but from Matt...

I clearly wrote "people like Mudwhistle" so that I couldn't be accused of something I couldn't back up. And since Mudwhistle is clearly baiting this entire race-based war thread, I don't think I'm exagerating here. This thread is just nonsense meant to get Americans to tear each other apart some more instead of focusing on important issues.

I would do the same thing if some dingbat were to start a "McCain starts ageist war!" thread.

Haven't we seen enough of these petty threads? We've already had to endure the "Are they eligible to be President" threads, one of which continues to carry on somehow onto 7 or so pages.

Hilarious.

What's with all the over-sensitivity, too? I have one conspicuous poster who baits me because I'm a dual citizen and you don't see me whining to the principal.

I think it's fair game to say that partisan hacks who are passive-aggressive and in the mould of Mudwhistle have started the race thing before Obama ever brought it up. It's disingenous to say that Obama started it with all the crap he's been getting already that isn't even true.

I can't really stand either candidate, but at least hit them on the big picture stuff and not the race vs. age crap. It's petty.

If you find it to be petty, one has to wonder why you bother participating...

To put the record straight (which you have twisted so much you've swallowed your own foot) John Kerry did release his military record, in full, and the United States Navy is on record attesting to such.

T. Boone Pickens reneged on $1 Million prize, by changing his standard of proof, asking for nearly the impossible--actual war footage. Well now veterans who served with and under Kerry have written a formal letter to Pickens asking for an apology--which they and Kerry deserve.

The fact remains the Republicans smeared the honorable service of a war hero, and I don't that term loosely--Kerry didn't merely come out of Vietnam alive, he exhibited heroic acts of bravery, not only in combat, but also as a witness to Congress as to the horrors of war.

What thanks did he get by those of you who claim to "support" our troops?

In 2004, the choice was clear, a war hero in John Kerry, or a toy soldier in George Bush; unfortunately too many choose the toy soldier.

IMHO, McCain isn't fit for Commander in Chief, he's an attack dog and would serve better as a Defense Secretary. Obama has exhibited, in his private--and public--life the understanding and perseverance required to tackle complex issues with success.

Who am I kidding, if you still believe the swift boat lies, there's really no point in discussion, you've already handicapped yourself.

__________________
"Shake off all the fears of servile prejudices, under which weak minds are servilely crouched. Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call on her tribunal for every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear."

-Thomas Jefferson

Oh dude, I heart you man! You're like those two old farts in the Muppet Show. I have a sense for what you stand for here and there, but mostly you just sit contently on the sidelines sniping at people who declare proudly and directly what they think. But that's fine. I can deal with that.

I participate because I don't think pettiness and small-mindedness should be able to reign freely without other voices calling them out on it.

I remember 4 years ago when I was new to this forum. I would read practically every single thread and at first I had this crazy notion that people who really cared about politics were participating. It was only a short while later that I discovered that many people are here to begin threads just like these.

"FALSE OUTRAGE" threads.

Threads where people take offense because someone like Obama clearly went on defense, but posters who act as though Obama started it. It's nonsense.

The hate-machine in America drives it's own citizens against one another and I'm happy to point it out whenever possible. The hate-machine got McCain in 2000 when it successfully derailed his bid for president then because it got many conservative voters to turn on him precisely because of the race card; remember his "black baby out of wedlock"?

McCain hadn't armed himself and didn't strike back. Obama has. In my mind, I don't think posters should be able to get away with that kind of baiting right off the top when they introduce a new thread.

This thread, off the top, reads kind of like something you'd get from a very new member who doesn't know any better.

So, by "people like Muswhistle", you mean "people who do things Mudwhistle has never done"?



You should not be making personal observations about other posters in the first place, but when you falsely do so you should at least have the courtesy to apologize for the error.......

Frankly, the points you are trying to make are diluted by the blanket insults you've sunk to lately, and your false characterization of Mudwhistle vis-a-vis Obama's name doesn't help, either.

Matt

I often disagree with the poster in question. But that should not prevent me from pointing out a blatantly false characterization.

I've done the same when, as an example, moon was falsely characterized.

Matt

On this, we fully agree.

Matt

Amen. I'm so happy I'm not a US voter right now. This is not a vintage year in American politics.

I'm not sure the guy was being sarcastic, as it appears many believe. I think he may have been being genuine. However, as soon as someone characterizes Mudwhistle as "even-handed," people immediately think he's being disingenuous.

__________________
"The nice part about being a pessimist is that you are constantly being either proven right or pleasantly surprised.”
- George Will

How is this even a topic. A race war? Seriously? Between who? The white women, black men and women, latinos (mostly women), college graduates, working class who support Obama. And the white, partially latino, mostly men, supporters of McCain? This is so stupid. Obama has a broad universal appeal. He would not have won the broad number of states he won. His constituency is much broader than McCain so...I'm not sure exactly how a "race war" is going to start. Who is going to fight it and where? Should people who start threats just be allowed to speculate about insane theories loudly with no challenge? How did we get to page 4 of this thread and no one said, "hold up, this is DUMB!"

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Yesterday, John McCain actually said that if he’s president he’ll take on, and I quote, 'the old boys’ network in Washington.' I’m not making this up. This is somebody been in Congress for 26 years, who put seven of the most powerful Washington lobbyists in charge of his campaign. And now he tells us that he’s the one who’s gonna take on the old boys' network,” he said. “In the McCain campaign that’s called a staff meeting!- Obama, 9/17/2008

Hold up, this is DUMB!

__________________
"Shake off all the fears of servile prejudices, under which weak minds are servilely crouched. Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call on her tribunal for every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear."

-Thomas Jefferson

I guess if I have to parse every single word to make myself absolutely clear, than here goes. I think you're just being cheeky Matt. When I said "people like mudwhistle" I meant that as a blanket insult to people who use FALSE OUTRAGE! all the time on this forum and start threads for no other reason than to see how crazy those threads get.

It's akin to trolling. You've been around for what, 25,000 posts? I bet you've seen tons of threads just like this where people bait and then sit back to see what kind of damage and drama will ensue. I don't think I'm being too cynical in insinuating that people do this, but I think it's really cynical and quite a shame that a poster with as much experience as mudwhistle would start a trolling thread. But then it's pretty much a crying shame that I've gone batty these last few weeks and gotten myself demerit points or whatever they're called, but it's hard not to cave in to how passionate you can get when you notice that the level of discourse on so many threads either comes from FALSE OUTRAGE! threads or trolling threads.

Sorry Mud, you never said Hussein, bully for you. I guess I just got things all wrong. Reading your original post, it clearly reads like you're looking at things from a very level and open-minded gaze.

I'm such a jerk. Please forgive me.