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Reply With QuoteWhile there may well be reason to be "at war" with a percentage of the population the reason for going to war should really be something better than "because they have something I want". Shouldn't it?Originally Posted by Jefe
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President
Yeah. "Warfare" against o.3% of the population. The other 99.7% are to believe that this is a terrible, terrible thing. "OMG, the libs are pushing for CLASS WARFARE!!!". LOL, durr, most of us are on the same team.
Administrator
While there may well be reason to be "at war" with a percentage of the population the reason for going to war should really be something better than "because they have something I want". Shouldn't it?
President
Isn't that why most wars are fought?
Moderator
And when the same type of lopsided majorities were against gay marriage?
Looked at from that perspective, this is a naked attempt at making a wedge issue.
Also as much of these proposed increases reach down to 200k (or less) it falls on the top 10% and that is the group that already, today, pay most of the taxes.
I will remind everyone that 47% of tax filers pay no Federal INCOME TAX, and of those, 20% actually get more back than they ever paid in.
Alternate Minimum Tax?
How about a Alternate Minimum Tax?
President
Why don't you check out what the debt was when the rich were taxed at the 93% rate, or the 70% rate.
Here I'll do it for you, the total debt was less than a trillion.
What happened when we abandoned "tax the rich"?
Here, I'll do it for you, the debt grew to over 14 trillion.
So why is it so hard to go back to doing what worked, after 30 years of "low taxes for the rich" has failed to produce what the GOP said it would produce?
The bright spot in that 30 year period came after (wait for it)
taxes on the rich got raised.
Then taxes on the rich got cut, and here we are in shit city.
Administrator
No.Isn't that why most wars are fought?
However, that's why most wars are started.
President
That's Donald Trump's idea, a one time 15% assessment on net worth over 10 million dollars.
Clean up the balance sheet and move forward.
President
A distinction that doesn't really matter - I think you saw my point.
Can someone explain to me what's so bad about this dreaded "class warfare"? I mean, besides the fact that, like, Paul Ryan said it's bad? What's gonna happen if we engage in this so-called "class warfare"? Are the "job creators" going to suddenly stop creating jobs? Oh, wait...
Secretary of State
It strikes me as this Trump proposed method of dealing with it has more merit to it than a permanent tax hike for a temporary spending measure as proposed by the administration.
If a man were behind four months on his mortgage and was talking to you about his plans to build an addition on his home you would think him daft and delusional. But in Washington, ignoring a current crisis to discuss grand dreams is called “boldness” and “vision.”
Administrator
Strange that you think the distinction doesn't matter.
If someone broke into your house and attempted to "commandeer" your food and your possessions would you find yourself "at war" for the purpose of gaining something you didn't have?
President
So lemme get this straight; Obama is pushing for a plan where half of it is spending cuts and the other half is very modest tax increases on other people just like himself, and somehow that's class warfare? Meanwhile, Republicans wish to raise taxes on the middle class.
Go figure.
Obama's going to win next year because the Republicans are just too stupid by a nose with defending the wealthy, but wanting to tax the middle. You just can't sell that in an election year.
Secretary of State
That'd be fine by me, and we could accurately calling it taxing "the rich."
Administrator
Did I miss something? Where is the Republican plan to raise taxes on anybody, much less the "middle class".
Joint Chiefs of Staff Member
Payroll Tax Cut: GOP Resistant To Extending Obama Policy
When I gave food to the poor, they called me a saint. When I asked why they are poor, they called me a Communist.
-Bishop Hélder Câmara
"I like to pay taxes. With them, I buy civilization"
Oliver Wendell Holmes
Moderator
Just a reminder:
Who pays taxes?
From the CBO…
http://www.cbo.gov/publications/coll...ity_shares.pdf
in 1999 in the grandly remembered Clinton years here is who paid how much of the tax burden:
Lowest Quintile 1.1%
Second Quintile 5.2
Middle Quintile 10.2
Fourth Quintile 17.8
Highest Quintile 65.6
Top 10% 51.0% (so the top 10% paid 51% that’s half for those that are math challenged)
Top 5% 40.2
Top 1% 24.3(and the top 1% paid 24.3% that’s one-quarter of all taxes for those that are math challenged)
Lowest Quintile 0.8 %
Second Quintile 4.4
Middle Quintile 9.2
Fourth Quintile 16.5
Highest Quintile 68.9
Top 10% 55.0% (so the top 10% paid 55% that’s more than half for those that are math challenged… and 4% more than they paid under Clinton)
Top 5% 44.3
Top 1% 28.1 (and the top 1% paid 28.1% that’s more than one-quarter of all taxes for those that are math challenged… and 4% more than they paid under Clinton)
More interesting still is people’s share of individual income tax liabilities. This chart shows the impact of programs like the Earned Income Tax Credit that actually will send back to the person filing more money than they paid in during the year.
Under Clinton:
Lowest Quintile -1.9
Second Quintile 1.3
Middle Quintile 6.1
Fourth Quintile 14.0
Highest Quintile 80.6
Top 10% 66.7%
Top 5% 55.1
Top 1% 35.0
Under Bush
Lowest Quintile -3.0
Second Quintile -0.3
Middle Quintile 4.6
Fourth Quintile 12.7
Highest Quintile 86.0
Top 10% 72.7 % (so the top 10% paid 55% that’s more than half for those that are math challenged… and 4% more than they paid under Clinton)
Top 5% 61.0
Top 1% 39.5% (and the top 1% paid 28.1% that’s more than one-quarter of all taxes for those that are math challenged… and 4% more than they paid under Clinton)
We are taxing the rich… the rich are the only ones being taxed. When the top 10% are paying 72.7% of the individual income tax liabilities you cannot say different.
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