Signatures are not votes...
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Signatures are not votes...
One of the pro-recall groups in their rules to petition circulators was "You may circulate more than one petition, as well as sign more than one petition, however, let it be noted that only one signature will be counted".
Of course, the Breitbart people take that to mean that the Democrats are promoting fraud, whereas the sentence itself is basically laying out the rules to people, which are fair rules, unless tsquare and others disagree that only one signature will count if someone has signed more than once.
Then we must discuss how the "Mickey Mouse" and "Donald Duck" and "Jack Mehoft" signatures are handled... It is reported that there are 'many' of those types on the petitions.
Then we need to agree that having turned in 1 million signatures is not representative of much of anything, except for the zeal of some petition circulators.
There are always signatures that don't make the cut, that's why the target was 750,000, because there isn't any instance of more than a third of signatures being rejected. Which is why in the recent Virginia Brouhaha where the Newtster failed to make the ballot, no one checked Romney's signatures, because he turned in 50% more than were required, but they checked every one of Paul's signatures, because he missed the 150% threshold.
Really, use whatever sense you have to ponder the size of the conspiracy that could fake 750,000 signatures, and the probability of of such a conspiracy existing, and remaining under the radar ....
Last edited by goober; 01-18-2012 at 02:50 PM.
For now, there has never been this high a turnout for a recall petition in history.
Gray Davis was recalled with 7% of the electorate's signatures.
Wisconsinites got 25% of the electorate on board. Makes sense, now that Scott Walker's approval rating is in the cellar as moderate Republicans have abandoned him en masse.
The polls all look good enough for Walker, and with the economy improving and his reforms working well, it's hard to see his numbers dropping.
Last poll taken had his approval at 47%. The recall was opposed 47-49. This was in October. A November poll showed the recall winning 58-38, but that's one hell of an outlier and it's by a pollster without the credibility of PPP, who took the October poll.
Of course, Walker's popularity could have plummeted by that much in only two months, but I haven't heard about any events in Wisconsin that would turn public opinion against him so viciously.
Anyway, I hope democratic interest groups spend a LOT of money here. That's money that won't go to the President's reelection campaign or to defending the Senate. This race is relatively unimportant for Republicans. They'd gladly lose Walker and capture the White House and Senate.
And the gov't kickstarted it.
Terribly progressive era.
The last 30 or so years have been a terribly regressive era.
HERE is what the Republican Party USED to stand for...
Republican Party Platform of 1956
August 20, 1956
Our Government was created by the people for all the people, and it must serve no less a purpose.
The Republican Party was formed 100 years ago to preserve the Nation's devotion to these ideals.
On its Centennial, the Republican Party again calls to the minds of all Americans the great truth first spoken by Abraham Lincoln: "The legitimate object of Government is to do for a community of people whatever they need to have done but cannot do at all, or cannot so well do, for themselves in their separate and individual capacities. But in all that people can individually do as well for themselves, Government ought not to interfere."
Our great President Dwight D. Eisenhower has counseled us further: "In all those things which deal with people, be liberal, be human. In all those things which deal with people's money, or their economy, or their form of government, be conservative.
"We shall ever build anew, that our children and their children, without distinction because of race, creed or color, may know the blessings of our free land.
We are proud of and shall continue our far-reaching and sound advances in matters of basic human needs-expansion of social security-broadened coverage in unemployment insurance - improved housing- and better health protection for all our people. We are determined that our government remain warmly responsive to the urgent social and economic problems of our people.
"Under the Republican Administration, as our country has prospered, so have its people. This is as it should be, for as President Eisenhower said: "Labor is the United States. The men and women, who with their minds, their hearts and hands, create the wealth that is shared in this country...they are America."
The Eisenhower Administration has brought to our people the highest employment, the highest wages and the highest standard of living ever enjoyed by any nation. Today there are nearly 67 million men and women at work in the United States, 4 million more than in 1952. Wages have increased substantially over the past 3 1/2 years; but, more important, the American wage earner today can buy more than ever before for himself and his family because his pay check has not been eaten away by rising taxes and soaring prices.
The record of performance of the Republican Administration on behalf of our working men and women goes still further. The Federal minimum wage has been raised for more than 2 million workers. Social Security has been extended to an additional 10 million workers and the benefits raised for 6 1/2 million. The protection of unemployment insurance has been brought to 4 million additional workers. There have been increased workmen's compensation benefits for longshoremen and harbor workers, increased retirement benefits for railroad employees, and wage increases and improved welfare and pension plans for federal employees.
In addition, the Eisenhower Administration has enforced more vigorously and effectively than ever before, the laws which protect the working standards of our people.
Workers have benefited by the progress which has been made in carrying out the programs and principles set forth in the 1952 Republican platform. All workers have gained and unions have grown in strength and responsibility, and have increased their membership by 2 millions.
Furthermore, the process of free collective bargaining has been strengthened by the insistence of this Administration that labor and management settle their differences at the bargaining table without the intervention of the Government. This policy has brought to our country an unprecedented period of labor-management peace and understanding...
Republican action created the Department of Health, Education and Welfare as the first new Federal department in 40 years, to raise the continuing consideration of these problems for the first time to the highest council of Government, the President's Cabinet.... We have supported the distribution of free vaccine to protect millions of children against dreaded polio.
Republican leadership has enlarged Federal assistance for construction of hospitals, emphasizing low-cost care of chronic diseases and the special problems of older persons, and increased Federal aid for medical care of the needy.
We have asked the largest increase in research funds ever sought in one year to intensify attacks on cancer, mental illness, heart disease and other dread diseases."
Equality, rightly understood as our founding fathers understood it, leads to liberty and to the emancipation of creative differences; wrongly understood, as it has been so tragically in our time, it leads first to conformity and then to despotism.
Barry Goldwater (R) Late Senator & Father of the Conservative movement
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.
John Kenneth Galbraith
It's also tough to call an era particularly progressive when government spent a lot less than it does now. Eisenhower oversaw a huge reduction in spending on his watch, even if he didn't try to repeal the New Deal.
Your mistake, like so many others appears to be equating Democrat with liberal and Republican with conservative. Couldn't be further from the truth, they're both stamped from the same coin and their only guiding principle is the furtherance of their own power.
A is A
The freedom and liberty mantra basically means the liberty for a few to be parasites on the backs of the many, with the many having the freedom to suffer this. Who are you trying to kid? All of the stats show the repubs for what they are, the hand maidens of the elites, and the enemy of average americans. There is a helluva difference between the party of Ike's era and today. They kept the cons, in the back corner, where they could do no harm to the Grand Old Party. Or to the nation, for that matter. And that is the change. The trail of damage these cons have left even have some cheering. They want more!
Love one another as you love your self. The other is you, at the most fundamental level.