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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
Traveler Traveler is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

How did he know the neighbor's home was unoccupied?
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
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Donkey_Left Donkey_Left is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Traveler View Post
How did he know the neighbor's home was unoccupied?
He shot them leaving, did he not?


Does it matter if their house was unoccupied? No.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
Traveler Traveler is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Yes it does...under Texaslaw is a neighbor is absent or away on leave or whatever, someone who is given the responsibility of lookinbg over the place, i.e. a neighbor has the right to shoot an intrudor or anone else he deems a threat to the property.

And yes he shot them leaving it, not knowing whether they were going to his property or not. I'm not sure whether that's reasonable grounds under self defense but he was well within his rights to shoot them for breaking into a neighbor's property.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
Americano Americano is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Traveler View Post
Yes it does...under Texaslaw is a neighbor is absent or away on leave or whatever, someone who is given the responsibility of lookinbg over the place, i.e. a neighbor has the right to shoot an intrudor or anone else he deems a threat to the property.

And yes he shot them leaving it, not knowing whether they were going to his property or not. I'm not sure whether that's reasonable grounds under self defense but he was well within his rights to shoot them for breaking into a neighbor's property.
Not unless the neighbor had specifically requested he watch over and safeguard that property. Didn't someone mention he didn't even know the neighbor?

Having been born and raised in Texas I'm aware he could skate on this with a local judge or jury due to the enormous emotion Texans expend on racial prejudice. Columbians would be viewed with the same attitude as Mezicuns.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
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O'Sullivan Bere O'Sullivan Bere is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Traveler View Post
Sorry, i thought it was Carribean and central rather than South America.

Under our "castle law" i'm not entirely sure what he did was actually illegal...someone else may well be better qualified to comment on it.
I'm not a TX lawyer (I could look up and apply the codes though), but even in 'stand your ground' states (which really only removes the traditional 'duty to retreat if possible' requirement to exercise deadly force in self-defence to a perceived deadly threat), such laws don't protect what Horn did.

First, this wasn't Horn's home being burglarised and Horn wasn't in it. Second, it appears the neighbour's home was unoccupied except for the burglars. If Horn knew the home was unoccupied except for the burglars, and is can be proven he went there with the intent to shoot them, then he chose to kill them for taking other people's personal property. Those 911 tapes made it sound as if he had that intent. Horn's lawyer claims a different version that the burglars lunged at him on his own property once they exited, but it seems contrary to what Horn indicated was his intent when he left with the gun. Horn is in legal trouble IMO.
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Last edited by O'Sullivan Bere; 03-02-2008 at 12:22 PM.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

There's no excuse for this man's behavior. Try him for first degree murder.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Extra-judicial execution is fashionable.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
Traveler Traveler is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Americano View Post
Not unless the neighbor had specifically requested he watch over and safeguard that property. Didn't someone mention he didn't even know the neighbor?
I dunno, from what i read they went away on vacation...

Quote:
Having been born and raised in Texas I'm aware he could skate on this with a local judge or jury due to the enormous emotion Texans expend on racial prejudice. Columbians would be viewed with the same attitude as Mezicuns.
Worse probably, at least we can usually work the Mexicans until Arpaio and the likes of him we have here on our state get a hold of them. Most Columbian illegals are not hard working folks looking to make a few bucks to send back to their family like Mexicans, they're usually bastards who smuggle drugs and people into the country.

As for getting away with it in a courtroom it won't get that far, nobody (whether it be the local police and sherriff, ATM, U.S. Attorney's office, FBI or state Attorney General) have signalled any attempt to charge this guy or now as they would need to, empanel a grand jury to indict the guy. this is going nowehere.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
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Donkey_Left Donkey_Left is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Not to get picky, but I would really like you to back up your assertions about ColOmbian immigrants.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
Traveler Traveler is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Quote:
Originally Posted by O'Sullivan Bere View Post
I'm not a TX lawyer (I could look up and apply the codes though), but even in 'stand your ground' states (which really only removes the traditional 'duty to retreat if possible' requirement to exercise deadly force in self-defence to a perceived deadly threat), such laws don't protect what Horn did.

First, this wasn't Horn's home being burglarised and Horn wasn't in it. Second, it appears the neighbour's home was unoccupied except for the burglars. If Horn knew the home was unoccupied except for the burglars, and is can be proven he went there with the intent to shoot them, then he chose to kill them for taking other people's personal property. Those 911 tapes made it sound as if he had that intent. Horn's lawyer claims a different version that the burglars lunged at him on his own property once they exited, but it seems contrary to what Horn indicated was his intent when he left with the gun. Horn is in legal trouble IMO.
But our law states that if he did indeed choose to shoot them because they chose to break into someone else's home, if he was the designated carer that is pretty much consistant with what the state allows.

I think the technicality of the law states he can if he choses, defend property under his care which is being trespassed upon, or something like that, but not on the grounds of taking other people's personal property.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
Traveler Traveler is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donkey_Left View Post
Not to get picky, but I would really like you to back up your assertions about ColOmbian immigrants.
No not Columbian immigrants, Columbian illegals.

Illegal aliens, not documented in anyway, not residential or otherwise.

It was just something i read on a staticstics sheet of crimes and violated crimes in co-rellation to one another and those being "non vetted" (i.e. nobody knows about them befor entrance into the country in this case) against law enforcement surveillance of those they already suspect of crimes.

Basically the report showed that all OTM illegals in the country had a majoity of nationals of their country wanted for more than just entering the country illegally, and a majority of that majority of criminals being wanted on felony counts.

I figured you of all people would ask, i'm not sure where i read it but i'll see if i can get a hold of it.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
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Donkey_Left Donkey_Left is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Thanks. I'm not even necessarily saying that your assertion is wrong, I'm just curious.

But good luck finding statistics on immigrants from Columbia.

*snerk*
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
Traveler Traveler is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

No it wasn't based on immigration so much as it was a record on crime and then of that how many were held by immigration detainers. That latter figure was then co-related with figures that ICE had on all other nationals of "x" country and everytime the FBP had a greater number of "statictics" (i.e. each person in their custody is a "statistic" and nothing more, dehumanise them if you will) than ICE had on non violatable issues for those if they had entered legally in the first place.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

It seems this guy's only real defense would be that he claims they "lunged at him" on his own property. Otherwise, they have him saying he was going after them.
A rather thin defense, but people have gotten off with less.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2008
noahath noahath is offline
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Re: Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars at neighbours'

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeMarine View Post
You are forgetting to add they were in the country illegaly, and he said " If you move, you are dead". Not, " move!... your dead"

He should not be in jail, he took the trash out. Is property worth defending? Hell yes it is. Property represents more than it's self, it represents all the hours you spent working to earn that property. Besides, those dudes had no right or reason to be in that house, it was not their house, and they knew it. They weren't confused, they weren't mistaken, They went to that house to rob it. Tthey were criminals, and nothing more. They were proven criminals, not suspected criminals.
He was not at risk. Based on the transcript of the conversation he was in no danger. The people weren't even on his property. A reasonable argument could be made for pre-meditation; considering he had time to call 911, and load the gun whilst on the phone.

I am not justifying the actions of the burglers and indeed they should have been arrested, charged, tried and imprisoned ... as should the shooter. If some elements of the media want to label him a "hero" for his actions, then it's little wonder so many Americans go on mass shooting rampages every few weeks.
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