I thought this might be of interest. It's a attempt to set up presidential debates that focus on science and technology. Here is the link if you are interested.

Sciencedebate 2008

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"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

I'd love to see this. It will be both the saddest, and at the same time funniest debate ever aired.

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Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

I think it would help us see how well the candidates can do when asked things they haven't had to repeat for the last year or so.

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"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

I like the idea, but think it would be more useful in the general election.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

Bear in mind it would make almost all the candidates look like ignorant dopes. I don't think most of them would join such a debate unless you forced them to.

I'm thinking, in a debate based on scientific knowledge, the only politicians in the last 20 years who might look even marginally educated would be Jimmy Carter and Al Gore.

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Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

jimmy carter?????

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No individual can plan his own existence in their view.

So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount.

Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated.

The Road to Serfdom
FA Hayek (interpretation)


Mortgage Backed Security survivor

Yes, Jimmy Carter. He was an engineer before he was a politician. Shoulda stayed an engineer, but what are you gonna do.

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Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

Al Gore?????? And Carter has a BS in physics. He is not an engineer.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

I don't know his particular credentials, but he seemed to have had more interest in science than most of the others, particularly the Internet.

Wikipedia

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Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

This is the problem I have with the way people like Carter and Al Gore are treated. I have many problems with both Carter and Gore. I think Carter was a lousy president and I think that Gore should have focused on climate change more as a candidate if he really is so passionate about it as well as disagreeing with him on many other issues. The problem I have is that people tend to just turn their names into a insult or pick on them on a personal level the way children do about unpopular kids at school. If you have policy problems with them fine but just saying their names is not a argument. The same sort of thing is going on with Hillary. I would love to hear what those on the right hate so much about Hillary but much of it is just saying the name as if her name is Lucifer and calling her childish insults like Hildabeast. And what's sad is that it works more than attacking their policies because people do not care about that so much.

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"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

That's why I included the clarification of what Gore said about the Internet in the Wikipedia quote. I get a little tired about people basing their dislike on him because of a misquote that is constantly repeated.

I'm no fan of Gore, Carter OR Clinton, but if you have something on any of these people, then PRESENT it. The other bullshit is just that, bullshit.

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Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

I have a question for that debate, "Do you agree with President Bush plan to go back to the moon and to Mars. If so, how do you justify the billions of dollars and risk to human life when there just isn't as much scientific gain compared to cheaper and more adapted robotic space exploration."

You can get to the top of a mountain with a helicopter too. It's not about how valuable space exploration is, it's proving to ourselves that we CAN do it.

I remember watching the Moon landings and the pictures from there. It wasn't "Ah, we coulda sent a probe" but more like "LOOK, we have PEOPLE there! OUR people! Just like you and me!"

Big difference.

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Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

We know we can do it, NASA should be past proving things we know we can do (especially when there is no political motivation this time around), they should be completely focused on the science. That being said, are you saying the huge cost in money and life is enough of a reason to go to Mars? It isn't cheap, and its at least part of the reason we're abandoning the ISS and why the ISS will be abandoned after only five short years of full operation. We're talking about huge cost, and risks so great that it has the potential kill the space program if anything went wrong. I just don't see the gains involved outweighing the risks/money involved.

Of course what it comes down to is whether you believe human achievement is NASA's goal, I thought it was space exploration and by the most efficient and practical method.

Yes. For one thing, the benefits from space technology aren't always apparent at first. Who knows how many scientific and technological advancements we may gain from the Mars program? The same "what's in it for us" argument was made about the Apollo program, and now we have literally hundreds of things we take for granted that resulted from the program. From smoke detectors to cordless tools to pacemakers that can be adjusted from outside the body, the benefits from the LEADUP alone were worth the cost.
And I remember the Moon landing make the whole world get together and cheer for Armstrong and Aldrin. We could use another unifying moment like that about now, couldn't we?
Then there is the small army of scientists working today who were spurred to take up that line of work specifically because of the Space Program.
And, last but not least, to paraphrase President Kennedy, we go to Mars, not because it is easy, but because it is hard. We need to have something to reinforce the idea that the human race hasn't degenerated into a huge mass of worthless meat infesting the planet.Don't count the ISS out that fast. Once a project like this, like the MIR space station, has run it's projected course, when it is found to still be in good shape, I am confident NASA and the international participants will be more than happy to keep it going.Risks. That's a big part of it. We as a people used to LIKE the idea of proving ourselves through risky endeavors. It's a sad commentary on the human race to think we live only for the comfortable and safe.
And there are PLENTY of people falling all over themselves to volunteer for a Mars mission. Let them worry about the risk.It's both. We haven't been to Mars. That alone is a good enough reason to go. Have you ever taken a short trip in the car and found yourself 400 miles away the next morning, only because it struck you as a good idea at the time, and you didn't regret it one bit?
It's like that, and as soon as we hang around on Mars for a while, we'll be setting our sights on even LONGER and riskier trips.

Unless we succumb to the "safe and comfortable" slow rot that is slowly permeating or society lately.

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Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.