I don't think it requires mysticism to recognize the incredible subtlety of the human mind.

Anyway, from the link, it sounds like they were saying they'd have the physical capacity to perform all the "calculations" of the brain in ten years. That's not at all the same thing as programming a conscious mind. I'd wager that's more like 50 - 100 years off. Though I do think it's possible, in principle.

My comment was to think that reverse engineering it was impossible - not duplicating it. The latter is a significantly more difficult (and arguably pointless) task.

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"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases."

-Thomas Jefferson

Never thought of the possibility of travel to get your augmentation, I imagine some nation would allow such procedures.

Regarding calculators, there was a time schools would not allow them during test periods, this of course did not last. I assume students are allowed to use computers and have internet access during exams now? Just asking.

I still believe there will be arguments, protests, perhaps even riots as those that refuse fall further and further behind.

If nothing else, such possibilities ensure we will not run out of things to argue about in the future.

I never should have read Kurzweil. Are you aware of any decent fiction that is based on such conjectures?

I don't vaguely ascribe to any mysticism in the thinking of humans. I simply doubt a human brain can be duplicated if it doesn't account for the inputs of biology and chemistry within the brain.
Also with a computer program one is able to reverse engineer software based on the understanding of what the output is with full knowledge of how the operating system and hardware function. The human brain however has no handy output center or fixed data storage.

You assume wrong.

When calculators are allowed on tests, the material is going to be such that a calculator won't help you unless you understand what you are doing. As for internet access...I've never heard of that in my entire life.

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"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good." --Thomas Paine

I don't know how calculators/PC's are regarded in schools these days. When I was in high school, we were allowed graphing calculators for math/science exams. I don't think we were allowed laptops, as this would have been 'unfair' as was the calculator some number of years before my time.

Technology comes out, is regarded as divisive and unfair, and then becomes ubiquitous and non-controversial.


I think we'll argue about them for a while, and then just use them without second thought. And, I'm not really aware of any science fiction that deals with these particular circumstances. If it's out there, it's probably the work of more recent authors. I read a lot of Arthur C Clarke, Isaac Asimov, and have a soft spot for Dan Simmons and his "Hyperion" books. A lot of existing sci-fi deals with the idea that the ultimate goal is to create humanoids out of metal (which is amusing, but not something I really understand - the human body is a poor design)

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"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases."

-Thomas Jefferson

I don't see why all inputs of "biology and chemistry" couldn't be accounted for.

As for full understanding of OS functionality, I'd submit to you that with the vast majority of OS being Microsoft and Apple's proprietary ones, full knowledge of the OS is a pipe dream, and yet reverse engineering still occurs. I've had to regularly reverse engineer software processes, and neither the hardware or othe OS is of paramount importance. It's just a question of making a chart (oversimplification) of "when I do X, Y happens". Once you get a complete enough picture for the behavior that you want to mimic, you simply write code to mimic the behavior.

Mimicking a brain would be no different, and people already take pale stabs at it with those AI bots that you can converse with (after a fashion). The concept is just that "when I say X, a person would probably respond with Y", but on a scale involving actions and perception as well.

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"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases."

-Thomas Jefferson

But we don't think that way. People consider many different actions and responses to X. There is no Y for every X.

That doesn't matter for reverse engineering. It's a black box. Thinking is internals of the box.

__________________
"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases."

-Thomas Jefferson

So they are going to create an artificial human brain that doesn't think?

No. To reverse engineer the brain would be to create a brain that produces the same reactions to stimuli, but with no guarantee that the internal mechanisms would be the same.

And, after a fashion this would be necessary. The human brain is carbon based, and we deal in silicon for the modelling, among other things that would dictate non-identical internal mechanism.

__________________
"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases."

-Thomas Jefferson

Which would make it, not a an artificial human brain but an impressive simulated intelligence computer.

well now you're just playing semantics.

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"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good." --Thomas Paine

I don't have half a dozen pens in my pen holder. I have six.

__________________
"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases."

-Thomas Jefferson

well there is a difference. it would be alot different from a human brain. human brains do more than just calculate stuff (though i guess technically its all math at some level, you know what i'm sayin).

this would be more like a very very good imitation of whoevers brain they reverse engineer. they should do it to steven hawking.

12 steven hawking brains. that would be epic.