Assuming you're referring to Iraq...history will judge it and GWB very kindly.

Thanks for your concern, though.

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"Compassionate Conservatism"?!?! That is a stupid phrase. Conservatism is inherently compassionate. It is liberalism that is cruel for the sake of maintaining a constituency.

The state and businesses should have never depended on illegals for anything.I am glad that our lawmakers in Oklahoma had the common sense to pass HB 1804.Hopefully other states follow suit and pass laws similar to Oklahoma's.

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"There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn’t an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag… We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language… and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people.”—Theodore Roosevelt

Who's going to do the work? Is your next statement a complaint about more companies outsourcing jobs without considering the tax burden that'll place on the remaining US workers after half the work force retires? Or is perceived sovereignty and law and order to a gnat's hair your big dream in life?

If a company goes out of business because they were hiring illegals , they got what the deserve fuck them.I do not feel sorry for the scum who deliberately betray this country by selling our sovereignty our to another country because they want dirt cheap employees.

Let illegals I.E. non-Americans do those jobs for substandard wages or let those companies outsource so they can still hire non-Americans to do those jobs for substandard wages? Those are good choices how?

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"There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn’t an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag… We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language… and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people.”—Theodore Roosevelt

Scum? Betray the country? Hmmmmmm. I wonder if this discussion is worth pursing.

Perhaps you're unaware of the ramifications created by a US company being denied unskilled or semi-skilled market price labor. If that company is no longer able to produce its products with cheap labor, the products are outsourced, not the company or employees. The company folds, along with its US tax contributions at all levels, the economic multipliers from the company products, economic multipliers from all employees, company officers and the CEO, board, stockholders and public presence.

Then we get to import those products. With a failing USD, stagnant wages, high inflation and embarrassing trade imbalance. The trade imbalance becomes even more embarrassing, consumers find it increasing difficult to consume items they could previously afford and last, but not least, our country's credit, which the world indulges us in, gets tighter and tighter.

I'm sure your wealth is invested in other countries currently attracting US investment provided by US capital gain tax cuts, so my explanation is most likely superfluous. If not, consider the fact that the US needs cheap labor and has a shortage of legal citizens in the work force. That'll become critical in the next decade as babyboomer retire and put their pressure on already overloaded social systems funded by tax revenue. Consider making illegals temporary citizens for tax purposes until a viable resident work force agreement is in place. You can easily enforce that at the employer level while facilitating their requirements and then legislate the agreement into what ever works best for the US. Lead or follow, active or proactive.

I agree 100%. The diseases they bring in and the tax dollars they cost us will eventually doom the country.

People are spouting off about a recession. Do the math. If we had all the money back that we give to these people some of our own countrypeople could actually eat and have decent medical plans. On top of that the amount in taxes each citizen pays would drop and maybe some people could actually make theie house payment.

A presence of over 11 million illegal aliens in this country is a sign that this country is losing control of its borders and the ability to determine who is a member of this national community. And a country that has lost that ability increasingly loses its ability to determine the rules of its society -- environmental protections, labor protections, health protections, safety protections.

In fact, a country that cannot keep illegal immigration to a low level quickly ceases to be a real country, or a real community. Rather than being self-governed, such a country begins to have its destiny largely determined by citizens of other countries who manage to move in illegally.

Doesn't matter who becomes president anymore. We are beyond the point of no return.

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If the average person's butt caught on fire I'd be willing to bet the American media could convince them its not in their best interest to put it out.

What solution do you propose for the present labor shortage, which will become aggravated to a crisis point with baby boomer retirement while reducing our tax base in a time of escalating social costs?

Your math is, to say the least, faulty. All I ever see in the anti-illegal emotional rants is unidentified social costs for illegals without corresponding economic multipliers from the businesses they service or attempted enforcement costs. Can you understand the simple formula of costs of attempting to seal US borders will far exceed any social costs and eliminate their economic contribution in an era of low-skilled labor shortage?

Sounds like your appetite for emotional pride will swallow your requirements and those of your children for affordable food and material goods. Your children and grandchildren will be able to peek out of their cardboard shelters formerly occupied by illegals and tell anyone who cares that they're proud to be Americans with intact border sovereignty because their father was too proud to implement a viable guest worker program.

Perhaps the first time I have disagreed with Americano but only to the extent that he has in the above paragraph failed to differentiate between legal and illeagle employees and lack of empathy for the need for the the firm to close because of the inability to find cheap labor.



IMO paert of the cure is for the consumers to live within their means and quit using IOUs to pay for their excess.


If a capital gains tax had "not" been reduced or even incrased would that actually have prevented investment.

IMO the "West" can "never" attain wages that will compete wth low wage entities and without a curb/or control on the export of our industry and capital some of the markets in the "West" will dry up as unemployment rises.

I suggested legalizing all who work as temporary residents for purposes of tax collection and retention of threatened businesses until we come to our senses and implement a viable resident work program. Emotional resentment is still far too high in many citizens for economic reality to enter the picture.

That'll eventually transpire when their credit and the country's credit is tapped out.

I think its very plain that reduced capital gain taxation reduced tax revenue while encouraging capital flight of that lost revenue in an era of deficit spending.

Due to the fact we now consume far more than we produce in a service economy and require foreign facilitation of our debt to keep the boat afloat isolation is an impossibility. Unless we crash and start from scratch.

Prehaps so !

It's obvious that this isn't a forum that is open to critical thinking or the exchange of ideas. Your posts are nothing more than the fear fueled racial charged rhetoric of a person incapable of understanding cause and effect.

You'll find many opinions by regular posters on this forum are driven by personal emotion and instilled dogma rather than critical analysis and forward thinking.

It is to be expected.

Expected yes, but given the seemingly high percentage of ex/serving military enlisted and civil service mentality posters a great many many discussions drift into emotional log jams with profanity, partisanship and blind patriotism becoming the norm. On the other hand there are some quality posters who periodically visit the forum with very worthy contributions. The volume is low, which makes subscription and contribution painless.

I think we need to know who is here, period. We need to secure our borders. We need to implement a guest worker program. Farmers should be able to bring migrant workers in for the season, pay them and send them home. Arizona has recently put into effect a very harsh penalty to companies that hire illegals and I think that is a good start. I have already seen a big decrease in illegals that were working at the hotel I work at. Even tho it is a big corporation, they got around it by hiring temps. That way the temp agency was responsible and not them. They no longer will risk it with the threat of a high penalty. As far as the 11 or so million that have been here for years, I dont know. I have compassion for them but something has to be done. They have children born here and are legal and do not know any other country but the u.s. We need to do something and I think securing the borders is the first step. Next, we need the ones who have been working and living here for years to register and companies need to sponsor them to be able to stay here or something. They need to pay taxes and we need to know where everyone is.