Policy on the use of "liar", "lies", "lying", etc.:

[Malvolio]

Originally Posted by muspell

So you don't do judgement calls on intent, then. Not in general, and not on single issues? Meaning that as long as a hypothetical poster (that should in no way be mistaken as the person it actually describes: me) avoids the forbidden words, there will be no threat from any moderator issuing warnings based on their interpretation of the situation?

While, and this goes without saying of course, as well as that this is not used to suggest how any moderator action is beyond reproach by definition, since no personal judgement was involved? Such as in a case where a mod would nevertheless use their interpretation skills freely, if such a thing actually happened, I mean?

We look at posts that get reported or when we feel that a post we see could violate the forum rules. Some cases are pretty obvious, others are more more difficult to decide and eventually controversial. The question of the allegation to be a "liar" towards another poster was such a controversial question. So ... considering all the facts and our experience ... we decided to put up this new rule, so nobody has to worry about interpretations whether it is insulting or not.

[Malvolio]

Originally Posted by Samantha

Wow I wish I could write as clearly as you and daisym. I'm relieved that someone else sees what I see as well. The mods don't notice maybe, that my threads get sidetracked with insults and off topic accusations? (one of the mods even gets in on that stuff). Anyway...from my point of view it gets really frustrating. I ignore and ignore and ignore and then suddenly I'm at my limit and can't ignore anymore. I try to do the right thing and alert the insulting off topic posts and ask for advice on how to handle it, and I hear nothing back from the mods, silence, and the offending posts remain. And then I fire back with frustration. That's the only part the mods seem to notice. This is just my perspective. I'm sure they have their own. Now am I in trouble for discussing mod inaction? Or is only discussing mod action not allowed?

Sam ... I know it's tough ... but IT'S YOU that it responsible for your post, not the mods and no other posters. If you can't make your point without having to use insults then DON'T engage in controversial discussions. If you can't take the heat, then stay out of the kitchen. If you can't play by the rules, then don't play.

[ViolaLee]

Originally Posted by Meridious

/chuckle

Talk about deja vu.

Your ears should be burning right about now. There are a great many posters here who more than likely feel the exact same way about the crap YOU dish out about how they "don't respect the constitution," "Aren't true Christians," and "don't believe in freedom of speech."

ROFL

This thread is GOOD!

I don't remember saying someone doesn't believe in freedom of speech. Meridious you are a lia.....errrr misinformed.

Whatever you are - I'm getting quite sick of your bullshit and attacks. But keep it up, especially on this thread, you and your buddies are just proving my point.

[MattLarson]

Originally Posted by Samantha

I don't remember saying someone doesn't believe in freedom of speech.

You did it! You refuted something someone said without namecalling!!!

We knew you could do it!!!!

Originally Posted by Samantha

Meridious you are a lia.....errrr misinformed.

Well, you almost did it. With a little practice, you'll get it right next time.

Matt

[ViolaLee]

Originally Posted by Malvolio

Sam ... I know it's tough ... but IT'S YOU that it responsible for your post, not the mods and no other posters. If you can't make your point without having to use insults then DON'T engage in controversial discussions. If you can't take the heat, then stay out of the kitchen. If you can't play by the rules, then don't play.

Right, like Curly said, blame the victim for the crime.

You seem to think I'm going around making my point with insults Malvolio? Do you actually read this message board?

The issue is my response to bullying posters who tell lies about what I believe and think. Not me trying to make a point. I do that just fine. The issue begins when my threads get sabatoged by the aggressive right wing types, who'd rather discuss me than the political issue in the thread.

It's OK for the bullies on this board to insult me with lies and false accusations, that's not the mods responsibility to do anything about right? So you don't mind if the board gets so hot that some of us leave the kitchen? You'll be happy with a right wing bully message board?

[Malvolio]

Originally Posted by Samantha

Right, like Curly said, blame the victim for the crime.

It's OK for the bullies on this board to insult me with lies and false accusations, that's not the mods responsibility to do anything about right? So you don't mind if the board gets so hot that some of us leave the kitchen? You'll be happy with a right wing bully message board?

Oh poor you .... if there is a victim here, Sam ... it's not you. Don't blame others for your own shortcomings. You are right about that I don't want any left wingers here that can't or don't want to play by the rules. I prefer posters that are capable and willing of having decent discussions. If they can't make their point without having to use insults, nobody listens to them anyway. I don't want no right wing bullshitters and I don't want no left wing bullshitters.

[MattLarson]

I should go get my violin.........

Matt

[Miranda]

Originally Posted by MattLarson

I should go get my violin.........

Matt

One should never be without a violin playing smilie. I'm shocked Marc didnt include one with the new batch!

[Meridious]

Originally Posted by Samantha

I don't remember saying someone doesn't believe in freedom of speech. Meridious you are a lia.....errrr misinformed.

Well, admitting 2 out of three is definately a start!

[muspell]

Originally Posted by Malvolio

We look at posts that get reported or when we feel that a post we see could violate the forum rules. Some cases are pretty obvious, others are more more difficult to decide and eventually controversial. The question of the allegation to be a "liar" towards another poster was such a controversial question. So ... considering all the facts and our experience ... we decided to put up this new rule, so nobody has to worry about interpretations whether it is insulting or not.

So, you do judgement calls on everything else than the word "liar", then?

Look. Thank you for actually explaining the reasoning behind the rule. It's much appreciated (and a few months late). *shakes head*

[SamInTheSouth]

Wow, I can't believe I am responsible for all of this.

And here, they always told me I'd never amount to anything.

[jimmyd95]

Hey Sam, and hello everyone as this is my first post here.

Sam, on the other board (we go back a ways) there has been similarly-themed threads. I thought you said this place was different? Why make me go through the trouble of signing up for this site when I could get the same crap over there? Kidding.

Now, what if I call myself a liar? Will that destroy the space-time continuum or something?

[daisym]

Originally Posted by Samantha

daisym I appreciate your thoughtfulness in making this thread. It's nice to know I'm understood, yet I'm sorry that some posters slandered you with anti-American insults.

It just seems off balance for the forum rules to allow a person to insult and slander another poster with lies and at the same time, not allow that person being slandered to state that they are being lied about.

I feel that if the moderators don't do anything about the slander, then the rule about pointing out the lie should go. For balance.

Sam, The reason I started this thread is because of the bullying that is common on this forum.

I understand that we can't have controls on bullying as can exist in other environments, and I also understand that the mods try to do the best job they can, however the problem I have with the thread that I referred to in my original post was that it seems the mods were condoning bullying behaviour.

Bullying behaviour is:
• enduring and repeated in nature.
• inappropriate, but not always aggressive.


I draw your attention to the fact that the people I am referring to indulge in put downs and attacks of a personal nature on a repeated basis. They will often carry an issue over from another thread, and often appear to target particular posters.

This is unpleasant. I believe we have lost posters due to this behaviour (and as I have said above, I don't believe that this behaviour is the sole preserve of one side of politics or another).

By telling posters to 'deal with it' the moderators are basically pretending it isn't happening.

I think I have made it clear that I understand that the moderators don't have time to police every post on this board, and if that was required of them why would they bother being moderators in the first place anyway?

I appreciate the time they DO put in - BUT - I think that when a person gets so frustrated with a net bully, rather than having a go at the victim it would be better to say - yes we UNDERSTAND why this behaviour upsets you - and IT IS unacceptable, and even to pm the offending party and let him/her know that they have gone over the line. This doesn't have to be a sanction, just a friendly reminder that such behaviour is offensive, and it would be best to discuss the content of the thread rather than what you like/dislike about the poster.

we shouldn't, as a community of adults, need to have rules about this, but we can deal with it better than what we do.

And having said that - I know that I have made some pretty nasty comments about one or two people as well. If anyone wants to remind me to be more adult, I have no problem with that.

[daisym]

Originally Posted by Samantha

Wow I wish I could write as clearly as you and daisym. I'm relieved that someone else sees what I see as well. The mods don't notice maybe, that my threads get sidetracked with insults and off topic accusations? (one of the mods even gets in on that stuff). Anyway...from my point of view it gets really frustrating. I ignore and ignore and ignore and then suddenly I'm at my limit and can't ignore anymore.

this is a classic response to being bullied

I try to do the right thing and alert the insulting off topic posts and ask for advice on how to handle it, and I hear nothing back from the mods, silence, and the offending posts remain. And then I fire back with frustration.

again - this is classic when the victim of bullying is not being supported.

That's the only part the mods seem to notice. This is just my perspective. I'm sure they have their own. Now am I in trouble for discussing mod inaction? Or is only discussing mod action not allowed?

and this ALSO sounds exactly like the kid whose been picked on at school, eventually explodes, gets hauled down to the principal and gets suspended for backchatting the principal when they try to present their side of the story.

Sorry guys, but this is CLASSIC.

[Meridious]

What a laugh.