How it appears to you is not really important. I would say most Arab propaganda is cheap and unsophisticated, given their lack of resources and influence in the global media. (al-jazeera is catching up to the western media though). Israeli propaganda, on the other hand, is very well placed and sophisticated, given the overall influence and power they wield in the media and politics. Probably why you don't recognize it for what it is. Effective propaganda does not seem like propaganda at all. As we can see by the phony pictures you provided, these were amateurs at work on the Lebanese side, and it was very recognizable for what it was. Especially the smoke billowing photo over Beirut, most people could spot that as a fake, or at least strange.

America is Israels only friend??? I don't think so. Canada, Australia, the UK, Japan, and so on.. None of us arm them to the teeth like the US does, but that has hardly improved their situation anyway.

Both sides behave quite crazy. You talk about Israel sending a message, but they are entirely ineffective. You don't bomb people and call it symbolism or 'sending a message', that is terrorism by any definition. Same with the Palestinians and hezbollah. The cycle of violence for both sides is not producing peace. Israel does not get a pass. They have stolen land through violence and that is the original source of the problem. Like it or not.

Israels retaliation is bad. It just does not look bad. Killing people who are not launching attacks against you is plain old murder. Same with Hezbollah and Hamas, of course. But Israel has deadlier and more brutal weapons, and so the damage and suffering they cause is always a few magnitudes greater. In time their enemies will possess the same weapons and they will not hesitate to use them. Peace has to come sooner rather than later, and the military means of achieving that end is not legitimate.



I think that this practice is common for all sides. Just look at the situation, a couple soldiers are kidnapped and the whole world knows their names.... hundreds of innocent Palestinians and Lebanese are kidnapped or killed every year by Israel and the media never says their names or shows their pictures.

This has the effect of people identifying and sympathizing with the poor Israeli soldier and his family. But we don't get the reverse in the western media. This is propaganda.

I agree you provided information. And it is important information, absolutely. The reason i called it a bit of disinformation is because of the obvious bias towards Israel by the commentator suggesting that Israel is not guilty of any crimes. That is just not true. If it was legit journalism it would have provided both sides of the story. It would have showed how propaganda is used by all sides in war and politics, it would have let the viewer decide his own conclusions. Instead it forced a conclusion on the viewer, and that conclusion was that Israel was good, and the other side was bad. That is far too simplistic for my tastes.

Andrew

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Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

What a load of bullshit.

First argument >>> "Yeh right". What an argument

About the guy with the cap: he was helping, then he died.. what's wrong with that?

About the lady: the pics were published at different times.. what's wrong with that?

If someone wanted to make photos look real, I don't think they'd use the same people.. that would be suspecious.

Fire in junkyard: Israel bombed a junkyard in Beirut??!

And what's with 'placing objects in a scene'? That's bullshit... It just makes the pic look fake... I bet the guy edited the pics himself.

metalted;
Your bias is already getting the better of you. I gave you a link to an ISRAELI news source, not the Palestinian News or al Jazeera. You predictably ignored that, just like any other propaganda victim would.

You are, inevitably, going to find it very tough when you realise just how many Israelis support the Palestinian position. Your choice will be to either move further right towards Zionism or change your pre-programmed opinions of all things Arab.

I did not ignore it, you just gave me a source thats wonderfull. It be no different then giving me the bbc website. whats the difference? I do not have time right now to read the entire thing. Would you like me to read something in particular?

Yes, daily events through the eyes of the Israeli press, like I said. Then you might stop burdening everybody with hasbara, and outdated hasbara at that.

And it is very much different from the BBC. The BBC only offer watered-down reporting on the Middle East. If you want the truth you have to look at either the liberal Israeli media or the liberal Arab media. You'll find very little truth emanating from the right wing .

very interesting photos showing the lies of media
may God Help Isreal and christians against the islam terror

We could do with some help against pseudo-Lebanese back-slapping.

[quote=doniston;882017]Rahul;881808]Hehe - tell us some rhymes from the naughty nursery. Should be funny!RESPONSE I tried that a few months ago, but most of the respnding posts were absolute filth. Things can be mildly raunchy with out being filth. but here's one:

A Hickery-Dickery Ol' Doc
Kept his favorite mouse in a clock,
when the house burned down,
the story got roun',
that he kept her ash in a crock

OK????? I have posted others in various places on this forum, (you can find another in the OFF topic sectio under "denver Snow") I would do so in the poetry section again, but I'm sure the result would be the same.


"Since I don't know your gender", I also assume you are male, ('course that is just a guess --- with a 49/49 chance of being right)

I was suggesting that both sides are messed up. Often times you dont get to see the palestinian side.

Hamas and Hezbollah in my mind don't deserve to exist. Basicly you think that because Israel is stronger it is expected to be better. In other words you think Israel should be the "bigger man", and roll with the punches. Of course thier enemy will suffer more, thats what keeps them alive. They are in a hostile world, surrounded by millions who would love to exterminate every last one Jew in Israel. Now I can see why you might think certain things Israel did in Lebenon is wrong, but do you honestly expect them to do nothing? The whole conflict started out relatively small, an effort to punish those who captured the soldiers and bring the soldiers back to israel. Then the rockets came, what would you expect?

Of course I can think of other ways of solving the problem. If I was leader of Israel I would send an envoy to lebanon, And I would say Lebanon, "Militias from your country attacked ours. You must either crush them with our help and bring us the head of Nasrallah, or we will take over your country and establish a proper strong democracy in your place Your choice."



If you read what i wrote above you can easily understand why to a typical israeli man why he did not think his country was guilty of crimes. His country was provoked, and his country attacked Simple as that. You can go and read between the lines if you want look at the body counts etc sure, the body counts of the victor are usually lower in any war.

metalted;
That just goes to show how stupid you can appear if you take your 'arguments' from Hasbara Central.
There isn't any war, the Zionists are occupiers, responsible under international law for the captured territories. The numbers of slaughtered Palestinian civilians, including a great many women and children, is testimony to the brutality of a fascist invader. Their actions are condemned by the United Nations and human rights groups worldwide.

You won't succeed in wrapping fascism in any form of military honour,( so cross that particular offensive ploy off your list for starters.

Next.

I really beg to differ once more. This is not true.

Just take a look at WWII and the body counts of the Germans VS that of the Soviets.

This sounds like Zionist PR to compensate for world indignation over the piles of Palestinian corpses. Comments ?

Well I couldn't hear it because I seem to have fried my soundcard again. I have a bad habit of plugging my ancient modified fuzzface distortion unit directly into my soundcard because I like the sound. Every once in a while it ruins it. But that's OK, I get them very cheap.

But from the subtitles, to me it seems that that woman is a real bitch that only sees things in black and white. I suspect that she is brain damaged. And judging from her age there is no hope that she will ever get better. She is a lost cause.

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We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Maybe I should rephrase that.

The Superior military will always inflict more casualties. there you happy?