wow, cool, so when you do finally come out from the closet in some particular, detailed manner, PLEASE, I beg of you, let me know, day or night, PM me for god sakes cause I want to be there, newsreels and all.


On topic; you said you are in law enforcement, okay have you ever heard of seen or know of a situation wherein a perp walked because the cost in relative terms to say the victims, society etc. was to high?

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"The captain has turned off the `No Dubbing' sign. You are free to speak any language you choose."

Read the rest of the post.

Because Cheney has pretty much telegraphed any details that people still weren't 100% certain about.

This is absolutely false. However ....

I suspect this is what a lot of people think will happen (myself included, but there is that 0.001% chance that actual justice will come from this)

The timing isn't suspect, he's been throwing this fake investigation around for months as a 'possibility', presumably testing the opinion waters. The main thing to be suspicious about is whether this is all just a way of whitewashing and condoning official torture policy by only prosecuting its boundaries.

Why thank you.
Interesting.

I think I started a thread about this... I'll see if I can necro it.

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Nothing to see here.

You know perfectly well that no one is saying that.

This thread is about the choice of a leftist ideologue like Holder and the decision to turn a serious issue into a partisan circus.

Shameless comments - and slanderous towards Matt and Imperator.

And you know it.

If by radical leftist, you mean he is fulfilling his office to the letter of the law, upholding the constitution and prosecuting people accused of crimes and doing it in a manner which removes the apparent conflict of interest. Then absolutely, he is a radical leftist. I mean you can clearly see his radicalism in the fact that he doesn't believe that anyone is above the law.

These aren't ideas that America was founded on. Republicans stand for the true meaning of democracy, where the government can do as it damn well pleases, with no restrictions on its abuses, no accountability, and never any prosecutions. Further when republicans are called to prosecute a politician, they are very careful to email Karl Rove and to receive the advice on who to prosecute and who to ignore, none of this special prosecutor nonsense.

No I'm sorry, this would do the exact opposite. The CIA and the Republicans created the fuel then lit it on fire by torturing people. In fact by doing so they got a lot of American soldiers killed, hampered the war in both Afghanistan and . The democrats need to clean up the mess by investigating the crimes and sending the guilty to jail. In an attempt to reestablish our image of being a nation of laws.

People keep reciting this, but if anyone died during the torture the CIA agents will be facing the death penalty. Do you really think that they won't roll over on their boss for that to be commuted? Do you really think a special prosecutor would turn down the opportunity to be involved in the case of a century? Quite frankly I think you know this can go all the way to the top, and that thought terrifies you, because it would cripple the republican party.

So you keep reciting that it won't go higher up as a way to reassure yourself, and you hope that someone might be convinced by your shear repetition. You're not fooling anyone.

It is far more widespread than ever before, that is a problem.

Its not that the public 'can't handle it'. Its that its wrong, criminal, too widespread, and hurts our standing in the world, not to mention jeopardizes our troops when they get captured. For god's sake we were torturing 12 year olds, and common taxi drivers. I think if bin laden's 2nd and 3rd in command get captured and we feel they know vital information and don't have a better way to get the information from them (which is doubtful knowing the vast array of known psychological tactics that don't even come close to torture), then they could legitimately be tortured. But when you catch a random guy who happened to be dropping off people from his taxi when a RPG hits a nearby military base and you pulpify his legs (<--- true story) until he is dead ... that's a big problem.

ahh yes, in he the force is strong, beleive I do....


actually no, its not. whats the however?


what is 'justice' in this conetxt?

Come on man, you are really lowballing the rhetoric he used and what he said and how and when. Holder said so as well. Christ I was sick if hearing how words count, and figured shiot how can you lie on that? But apparently that too, is subject to partisan hackery rules....wonderful, so mi amigo, when do they count? Will you let me know?

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"The captain has turned off the `No Dubbing' sign. You are free to speak any language you choose."

That's a romantic and idealistic view of Holder that has no relation to reality. Holder is a walking poster man for political correctness and a loose cannon who makes Joe Biden look like a model of discretion; he most certainly cannot be trusted to investigate this matter.

You sound like a press agent.

Really? So all Republicans despise the rule of law and the good-guy Dems are going to restore paradise for us?

What is this nonsense?

I haven't seen any posts from you here in a long time. I was gone for a long time, so maybe I missed them.

I don't remember you carrying on like this. Very odd.

Tim: do you or do you not think that if CIA agents broke the law they should be held accountable.

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Nothing to see here.

Oh gee I don't know, for the guilty to be convicted and sentenced according to Chapter 113c of the US Code. Is this your reaction to every prosecution?

Whether Holder is a leftist ideologue is immaterial (and completely unestablished by anyone here), Holder is the AG, right?
One of the roles of the AG is to investigate high level crimes, right?
The AG has the power to appoint an independent investigator to investigate the government itself because the AG's office is obviously in a conflict of interest, right?

Why is appointing a prosecutor to investigate the KNOWN practice of torture under the bush admin a 'partisan circus'? If your problem is that Holder is a leftist ideologue, then you ought to be HAPPY there is a widely recognized neutral investigator assigned.

Investigating a blowjob is a 'partisan circus'. Investigating an official government policy of torture isn't a circus, its the RIGHT THING. Now my main problem is that investigating only the extreme cases while allowing the fundamental policy to remain untouched is why it is a circus. That's like prosecuting the hitmen for the mafia while allowing the bosses to remain in business.

Sure does sound like a big problem, however, none of us have all of the information, we just get little tidbits here and there. That's a bigger problem, we either need to be left in the dark (which isn't a possibility any more since we live in the "information age") or be completely informed.

This is a serious issue: not the basis for a smug, disgusting partisan circus for Obama and his self-righteous minions to use to promote themselves.

The ony way to deal with this is a bipartisan committee to investigate this in privacy.

Instead, the Obama administration - which is in free-fall at the polls and in the midst of a deep recession - is turning it into a circus of self-aggrandizement.

Holder should not be doing this. Are you kidding? He is much too biased. His title does not change that.

This issue is very serious and your accusations against others on this forum (which you have not addressed) are tasteless and insulting. I take this issue very seriously and the attempts to use it to score points is nauseating.

I think you're about as informed as you can be when Cheney says damn near every night on national (and world) television "torturing prisoners saved american lives".