I discard the actual premise of your question - that the embargo is "unfair".

What, exactly, requires the United States to change our behavior towards that debacle of an island when they are insistent upon not changing their behavior which resulted in the situation, in the first place?

The "unfair" embargo might end when:

A) They finally admit Castro is, indeed, Tango Uniform
B) They admit that yet another communist/socialist experiment has failed
C) Castro's brother finds a ten foot pole with which to not touch a leadership position of any kind
D) They hold free elections

We'll know it's about time to "normalize" relations when people start swimming FROM Florida TO Cuba. That'll be a decent enough sign for me.

That's gotta' be the best "first post" I've ever seen...

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Obama's New "57 State Patriotic Pin":




Sayeth John Drake - 10/13/08: "OK, you're right, I admit to LYING"

Having a larger number in your bank account or owning a greater number of dollar bills in greater value does not improve ones grasp of economics. That you would even suggest this further proves (as if it needed any more proof ) that you have no grasp of economics or even common sense.Who is this "we?" I doubt there are many other people as irrational as you. And since when do I dislike laws, rules and regulations? It's true that I dislike irrational/unjust laws, rules and regulations, but I do not dislike them for the simple fact that they are laws, rules and regulations.Right, because it is an injustice.Even more irrationality from you. Would you like to embarrass yourself some more by posting some of the most absurd logical fallacies I've ever seen used, or do you believe you've reached a point where appearing even more ridiculous is impossible?

And when you're done, go back and address the portions of my previous post that you dodged.

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If a neocon whines about big government wealth redistribution, just ask him what he thinks about the portion of that big government that sends aid to Israel.

That it is unjust. The reason is that it is not the job of the US government to decide with whom US citizens should trade just because US leadership has a petty quarrel/disagreement with Cuba's leadership.So what you're saying is that the personal dislike of Cuba's leadership by US leadership is a valid reason to maintain an embargo?

Another point, you say free elections. Does that mean the US should have an embargo in place against any nation that does not hold free elections?What in the hell does that have to do with the justness of the embargo?

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If a neocon whines about big government wealth redistribution, just ask him what he thinks about the portion of that big government that sends aid to Israel.

How can it be stopped? Simple - Castro can die.

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In case you were wondering, yes, there really ARE more idiots these days....technology has made natural selection obsolete.

Your arguments have been decimated. You've proven nothing beyond the fact that you think the embargo is an injustice.

And, as we know, your opinion means exactly squat.

I think I'll let Impugn have the last word on keeping the embargo in place. His was a brilliant first post...

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Obama's New "57 State Patriotic Pin":




Sayeth John Drake - 10/13/08: "OK, you're right, I admit to LYING"

That was a pretty good fuckin' post, too...

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Obama's New "57 State Patriotic Pin":




Sayeth John Drake - 10/13/08: "OK, you're right, I admit to LYING"

Yikes...talk about pressure. Okay. I'll do my best.

I will set aside the fact that you seem to be equating the U.S./Cuba situation with, say, you not being allowed to hang out with your friend Tommy any more because his slutty sister Sarah said something mean about your sister during 8th period study hall... "Petty quarrel", indeed.

A long, long time ago this guy Castro seized power of Cuba. As with most leftists, he didn't reveal his true stripes until the reigns were firmly in his hands (one tends not to get much support when one is openly leftist). He booted the United States out and seized all the privately (foreign or not) owned property and proceeded to set up yet another Communist Experiment (why can't these people just do experiments in a lab like everybody else?). The people suffered.

Blah blah blah, Bay of Pigs, blah blah blah... He befriended the USSR and attempted to have Soviet ballistic missiles placed a scant 90 miles from our shoreline. These would have had the range to reach most of the United States including Washington, D.C.

It has since been revealed that it was nastier than JFK let on at the time. We were ridiculously close to nuclear war. That's right, Matthew Broderick, Global Thermo-Nuclear War. If the U.S. invaded (again, sorta), the orders were to launch 'em if they have 'em. Hell, they even had subs armed with tactical nuke torpedoes. That would have been fun!

When we run into countries we don't like, we have a number of options. We can invade them. We can try to change them from within (foment revolution). We can squeeze them economically. Invasion works, but can be messy: see Iraq. Trying to get them to change from the inside out can be frustrating and unpredictable: see Iran (hopefully). Squeezing that little banana republic, however, was entirely doable.

You see, I'd actually like to treat China that way right now. But, unfortunately, we've pinned our economic future on them. Cuba, on the other hand? Cigars? Meh.

So, the question is "who does this embargo hurt"? You sound as if you're affected by this, personally, but, at the same time, I hear about how the "silly" embargo can easily be "worked around" via Canada and whatnot, so I guess it's a mere inconvenience, really. By the way, Dominicans have made great strides with their cigars in the last few decades...but I digress.

So, who is punished? Them. So goes the old joke, then: "Hey, doctor, it hurts when I make my country a Communist dictatorship 90 miles off the coast of Florida!" "Uh, so don't do that, then."

If there is anybody to blame for the length of this embargo, it is them. I am willing to bet that had serious reforms been made within Cuba - even within the framework of a communist government - things might have eased up by now. But, NOOOOOOO! Castro persists and, still, countless people risked (and risk) their lives to get to Florida (Joke: Why doesn't Cuba have an Olympic swim team? Any of them that can float are already in Florida). Reagan might have been willing to bend a little - he had the capital to do it and would have loved to break the Cuba/USSR bond - but idiot Castro emptied his jails and insane asylums onto the shores of Florida. Real. Smart. Castro.

Communism is evil. Period. If you're young enough, you probably don't realize this. That is understandable. Just realize that regarding communism as harmless now is as irresponsible as regarding smallpox as harmless now "because people don't get it anymore" (we're learning a hard lesson there, eh?)

Communism is bad, m'kay. The abuses to the people there are myriad and are 100% due to the oppressive regime in control.

See how far Hugo Chavez takes things before - oil or not - Venezuela has some harsh treatment coming to it.

When those Cuban refugees in Florida think it's a good idea to maybe go back, then we'll know Cuba is worthy of better treatment. Really, they should be the ultimate judges. Would you be willing to live there, now? They aren't and they know the real deal - not just the part the leftist media shows. Says it all to me.

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"Compassionate Conservatism"?!?! That is a stupid phrase. Conservatism is inherently compassionate. It is liberalism that is cruel for the sake of maintaining a constituency.

Hehehehe... Maybe I shouldn't have let you have the last word. You attributed all of Slon's drivel to me!

That notwithstanding, the case you make is solid; so much so that it can't be broken down by the immature whinings of those who perceive some "injustice"...

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Obama's New "57 State Patriotic Pin":




Sayeth John Drake - 10/13/08: "OK, you're right, I admit to LYING"

Oops. Sorry about that. Bad Cut&Pasting. I was still within the "edit window" so it has been fixed.

Oh, and thank you.

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"Compassionate Conservatism"?!?! That is a stupid phrase. Conservatism is inherently compassionate. It is liberalism that is cruel for the sake of maintaining a constituency.

One thing that is often overlooked is that an EMP attack on the Atlantic coast would be devastating to the USA but would have negligible effects on Cuba.

In case of such an attack, their vehicles would still work because they are old and have mechanical ignition. They have points. However our vehicles with electronic ignition could be rendered inoperable by an electromagnetic pulse.

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... ..................
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Is that for the same reason an EMP would affect North and South Korea differently? Hehe.

I love this visual of yet another reason why Communism sucks. Guess which half of Korea is Communist and which ain't:




Our Amish up here would be pretty much immune...doesn't mean I wanna live like them though. (Mmm...shoefly pie...)

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"Compassionate Conservatism"?!?! That is a stupid phrase. Conservatism is inherently compassionate. It is liberalism that is cruel for the sake of maintaining a constituency.

Dodging arguments does not decimate them.Opinions can never be proven and injustice is a matter of opinion. However, I have supported my opinion with sound economic theories and pointed out the double standards and presence of irrationality in your opinions.

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If a neocon whines about big government wealth redistribution, just ask him what he thinks about the portion of that big government that sends aid to Israel.

I disagree. We certainly have dismantled far more than 1/10th of his arguments.

Sorry...heh...

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"Compassionate Conservatism"?!?! That is a stupid phrase. Conservatism is inherently compassionate. It is liberalism that is cruel for the sake of maintaining a constituency.