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Notre Dame Burns

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  • Notre Dame Burns

    Historic church suffers catastrophic fire. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...ins/ar-BBVYTqC

  • #2
    Regarding the burned church . .

    Censoring certain discussions because we might make "some people" mad...

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Censorship of discussion on the topic is already evident here in the U.S. As the fire was still burning, Sheppard Smith of Fox News cut off Philippe Karsenty, a conservative French politician and broadcaster, for even suggesting that the fire could have been caused by arson. And Neil Cavuto actually hung up on Catholic League President Bill Donohue when he dared to call the fire suspicious while mentioning in the same context the number incidents of anti-Christian vandalism in Paris just this year.

    At this early stage of the investigation, its fair to say no one can declare with certainty how the fire started. French authorities continue to peddle the line that the fire was accidental. At the time same, there is convincing evidence the scaffolding team and the French restoration experts working with them were extraordinarily cautious as they were well aware of the danger of fire in the cathedral. In addition, attacks on French churches and French Christians and Jews continue to grow.



    https://www.americanthinker.com/arti...dral_fire.html


    ?


    • #3
      Originally posted by Captain Trips View Post
      Regarding the burned church . .

      Censoring certain discussions because we might make "some people" mad...

      -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      Censorship of discussion on the topic is already evident here in the U.S. As the fire was still burning, Sheppard Smith of Fox News cut off Philippe Karsenty, a conservative French politician and broadcaster, for even suggesting that the fire could have been caused by arson. And Neil Cavuto actually hung up on Catholic League President Bill Donohue when he dared to call the fire suspicious while mentioning in the same context the number incidents of anti-Christian vandalism in Paris just this year.

      At this early stage of the investigation, its fair to say no one can declare with certainty how the fire started. French authorities continue to peddle the line that the fire was accidental. At the time same, there is convincing evidence the scaffolding team and the French restoration experts working with them were extraordinarily cautious as they were well aware of the danger of fire in the cathedral. In addition, attacks on French churches and French Christians and Jews continue to grow.



      https://www.americanthinker.com/arti...dral_fire.html

      Someday it'll be a mosque.

      ?


      • #4
        I heard this on the news, and the only thing I could think was 'such a shame, such a loss'.

        ?


        • #5
          These acts are being downplayed not investigated.

          But they are occurring.

          It's an interesting phenomenon we're seeing.

          It seems like our societies have become weak, that we're scared to talk about certain things.

          Especially things involving religion, anti-religion and fanaticism.

          There seems to be so many new kinds and flavors of fanaticism growing today.

          Whatever you happen to be moody, or upset about today...

          ... there's a rabid pack of nuts out there for you to sign up with !!

          Hate Christians and Catholics ?? Pick a group of hundreds to sign up with !

          So many options for unhappy dissatisfied people !

          Hate, terror and destruction are becoming very popular.

          ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          The fire to the iconic church, however, may have raised awareness to a rash of vandalism to French churches. A total of 875 of France's 42,258 churches were vandalized in 2018, with a small fire set to the Saint-Sulpice church in Paris in March, according to French police.

          In the same week that the fire broke out at the Saint-Sulpice church, another 11 churches were vandalized. According to the Ministry of the Interior, a total of 1,063 anti-Christian acts were recorded in 2018 alone.

          Other acts of vandalism to the churches include human feces spread on the walls of the Notre-Dame-des-Enfacts in Nimes and a damaged organ at the Saint-Denis basilica. Another 129 churches had thefts on their property with still another 59 cemeteries vandalized.

          Republication MP Valerie Boyer told the Sun, Every day, at least two churches are profaned.

          The fire at the Saint-Sulpice church, although small, was started deliberately according to police and will cost several hundred million euros to repair, Courrier International reported.

          There has been a call for more investigations in the anti-Christian acts in France by legislators as the acts of vandalism have been downplayed by church officials.


          https://www.ibtimes.com/notre-dame-c...d-2018-2785886



          Is it a news story if a church is set on fire or vandalized in some other way? What about if its part of a string of incidents? What if it happens five times? How about 10 times?

          What if there are flames pouring out of one of the worlds most iconic cathedrals and its Monday of Holy Week?

          We will come back to the flames over Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris in a moment.

          The answers to the earlier questions are yes, yes, yes, yes and, of course, yes! As someone who worked as a news reporter (and later a editor) at two major metropolitan dailies (at the New York Post and New York Daily News) and a major news network website (ABC News), I can tell you that any suspicion of arson at a house of worship, for example, is a major story.

          It must somehow no longer be the case in the new and frenetic world of the internet-driven, 24-hour news cycle. Thats because a major international story one involving at least 10 acts of vandalism at Catholic churches in France went largely unreported (underreported, really) for weeks. The vandalism included everything from Satanic symbols scrawled on walls to shattered statues.

          Thats right, a rash of fires and other acts of desecration inside Catholic churches during Lent, even in a country with a recent history of terrorism somehow didnt warrant any kind of attention from American news organizations. Even major news organizations, such as The Washington Post, were late to covering it and only did after running a Religion News Service story.

          This brings us to Mondays fire at Notre-Dame Cathedral in Paris, where a massive blaze engulfed the 12th century gothic house of worship. Its too early to tell if this incident is part of the earlier wave of vandalism, but it certainly comes at a strange time. For now, officials say the blaze remains under investigation. The cathedral has been undergoing some renovation work and the fire may repeat MAY have started in one of those areas.

          It would be crazy to assume there is a connection between all of these fires and acts of vandalism. It would be just as crazy for journalists not to investigate the possibility that there are connections.

          There will be more to come on the Notre Dame story in the hours and days that follow and comes at the start of Holy Week, the most solemn time on the Christian calendar.

          But back to my questions about the earlier string of fires and the lack of coverage. In my experience, fires were always a thing because they generally produced good art. Flames shooting from a window, whether a still photograph or video, was always a
          major reason editors put these incidents on their story budgets. In the case of the French churches, however, the photos tell only a small part of the story.

          I recall covering several church fires in New York City during my time as a general assignment reporter, one in February 1999 just days before Ash Wednesday and another in March 2002. In the case of the second blaze, no one was hurt and it ultimately proved to be an electrical fire. Nonetheless, sacred relics were destroyed in the process. That it happened during Lent had made it that much worse for worshippers and certainly a news story.

          Fast-forward to present-day France. Among the very first to write about the vandalism was Catholic News Agency with a story on Feb. 15 under the headline, Eucharist desecrated, statues smashed in series of French church attacks. That was followed up byCrux, another English-language Catholic news outlet that chose to cover the phenomenon over a month later on March 28. While the article was accompanied by flames shooting through the front door of St. Sulpice Church in Paris, it wasnt the reason why they wrote about it. Its worth noting that St. Sulpice is a baroque church completed in 1870. It is also the citys second-largest church, behind Notre Dame, and used in the movie version of The Da Vinci Code.

          Heres how the story opens:

          Vandals and arsonists have targeted French churches in a wave of attacks that has lasted nearly two months.

          More than 10 churches have been hit since the beginning of February, with some set on fire while others were severely desecrated or damaged.


          St. Sulpice, the second-largest church in Paris, after Notre Dame Cathedral, had the large wooden door on its southern transept set ablaze March 17.

          Investigators confirmed March 18 that the fire was started deliberately, according to the website of the Vienna-based Observatory on Intolerance and Discrimination Against Christians in Europe, an independent organization founded with the help of the Council of European Bishops Conferences.

          In early February, in the Church of Notre-Dame-des-Enfants in Nimes, near the Spanish border, intruders drew a cross on a wall with excrement then stuck consecrated hosts to it.

          ...

          The American press in particular has been negligent on this one. In fact, one of the first websites to write about the incidents for American audiences was Breitbart. Did coverage on the politically conservative site dated March 20 suddenly make this a right-wing story? It shouldnt have. Vandalism, no matter who the potential culprits are, should be reported by journalists. Is there a conservative or liberal way to cover a fire? I never thought so until now.

          The Brietbart story ends with several key statistics, further proving that these cases arent isolated, but part of a terrifying trend:

          The Catholic hierarchy has kept silent about the episodes, limited themselves to highlighting that anti-Christian threat and expressing hope that politicians and police will get to the bottom of the crimes.

          Reports indicate that 80 percent of the desecration of places of worship in France concerns Christian churches and in the year 2018 this meant the profanation of an average of two Christian churches per day in France, even though these actions rarely make the headlines.

          In 2018, the Ministry of the Interior recorded 541 anti-Semitic acts, 100 anti-Muslim acts, and 1,063 anti-Christian acts.

          Even with the RNS story out there for media subscribers to use, the only major media outlet to run the story on its website was The Washington Post. There was, for example, no New York Times story (just to name one of the largest newspapers in the English-speaking world) until Mondays Notre Dame disaster. Its hard to believe that a rash of fires tied to vandals isnt of interest to one of the worlds largest news organizations with a bureau in the French capitol.

          Why? Would this rash of sacrilegious attacks have enjoyed more coverage had they occurred in synagogues or mosques? Its hard to say. After all, the string of fires at black churches in Louisiana has warranted and deservingly so lots of media attention. On this series of fires, culminating with the arrest of a suspect on April 10, The New York Times did a solid job.

          What makes this story even more intriguing is that it remains largely a mystery who committed these awful acts. This was buried in the Newsweek account from March 21:

          The Vienna-based Observatory of Intolerance and Discrimination Against Christians in Europe, which was founded in cooperation with the Council of European Bishops Conferences (CCEE) but is now independent said there had been a 25 percent increase in attacks on Catholic churches in the first two months of the year, compared with the same time last year.

          Its executive director, Ellen Fantini, told Newsweek that while in many cases the motive for the attacks was not known, France faced growing problems with anti-Christian violence, especially by anarchist and feminist groups.

          I think there is a rising hostility in France against the church and its symbols," but "it seems to be more against Christianity and the symbols of Christianity.

          These attacks are on symbols that are really sacred to parishioners, to Catholics. Desecration of consecrated hosts is a very personal attack on Catholicism and Christianity, more than spray-painting a slogan on the outside wall of a church.

          She said that while France had a long tradition of secularism, it was seen as a culturally Christian country, and so any "attack on the church as a symbol of religion was also an attack on authority and patrimony.

          Maybe its the suspects in this case that made the mainstream press skittish to report on it extensively. Its true that foreign news is expensive for American news outlets. Furthermore, my experience is that Europeans know a lot more about what happens in America compared to what most Americans know about Europe.

          Nevertheless, the political unrest in France involving protestors clad in yellow vests have, by comparison, gotten lots of attention from many of these aforementioned news sites. Another good example, Brexit and its aftermath, has been something The New York Times and many U.S. news websites cant get enough of. Political stories, the new religion of our secular culture, are widely covered. The past few weeks has shown that when it comes to vandalism against Catholics, there isnt so much interest in covering it.


          https://www.getreligion.org/getrelig...are-vandalized

          ?


          • #6
            Happy Easter..

            UnGodly people

            Killing each other for God...

            -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



            At Least 200 Dead in Easter Day Attacks on Sri Lankan Churches, Hotels

            ...

            Last year, there were 86 verified incidents of discrimination, threats and violence against Christians, according to the National Christian Evangelical Alliance of Sri Lanka (NCEASL), which represents more than 200 churches and other Christian organizations.

            This year, the NCEASL recorded 26 such incidents, including one in which Buddhist monks allegedly attempted to disrupt a Sunday worship service, with the last one reported on March 25.

            Out of Sri Lanka's total population of around 22 million, 70 percent are Buddhist, 12.6 percent Hindu, 9.7 percent Muslim and 7.6 percent Christian, according to the country's 2012 census

            In its 2018 report on Sri Lanka's human rights, the U.S. State Department noted that some Christian groups and churches reported they had been pressured to end worship meetings after authorities classified them as "unauthorized gatherings."

            The report also said Buddhist monks regularly tried to close down Christian and Muslim places of worship, citing unidentified sources.

            Malcolm Cardinal Ranjith, the archbishop of Colombo, told local TV that the public should remain calm and asked authorities to bring those responsible for the attacks before the law. He also requested the public donate blood for the injured.

            Education Minister Akila Viraj Kariyawasam announced that all schools would be closed on Monday and Tuesday.

            The heads of major governments condemned the attacks. Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi said "there is no place for such barbarism in our region." Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan said in a tweet that "this is an assault on all of humanity.



            https://www.newsmax.com/headline/sri.../21/id/912590/


            ....


            First, it was an attack on a place of worship, which is a disturbing trend, if you can call it that, among terrorists. For awhile there, they were doing shopping malls, and places of commerce. They've tried military targets. They've gone after places of transport. Now they are assaulting places of worship, which are easy and trusting places (try getting past security at, say, Goldman Sachs, compared to a church or synogogue), and because places of worship are full of people, where they can get large numbers of casualties, maximizing the shock factor, which they seek. We have already seen horrific such attacks by Muslim militants on Christians in Pakistan and Egypt, and on Jews in the United States and well beyond the U.S. Muslim terrorists aren't the only ones going after houses of worship - a stray crazy committed mass murder in mosques in New Zealand, another godless lowlife burned several black churches in the Deep South, and a maniac was caught with a gas can in St. Patrick's Cathedral on a day after the Notre Dame de Paris inferno, whose origins are still being investigated. There was also the monster who opened fire on the Sutherland Springs church in Texas in 2017, and the murderous attacker who targeted the Pittsburgh synogogue who was a Nazi. There's something awful about the growing attacks on peoples of faith, as if faith can't coexist in the modern world full of Internet-obsessed lunatics.

            The attacks on the Christians and Jews are notable because they are organized efforts, the work of Muslim militants, and they seem to be intensifying. Sadly, Islam itself is a petri dish for this, because it is a decentralized religion and with a lot of ancient thinking throughout its writings, which enables a lot of discontented miserable people of the modern world who feel like failures otherwise to read it the way they want to read it - sometimes murderously. The latest result is this Islamist attack in Sri Lanka on Christians on their holiest day of the year. And it's not the first of such Easter attacks - we have been horrified to see other Easter attacks on Christians in Egypt and elsewhere with very large numbers of casualties.

            What can we say about the specific attack on Sri Lanka? The Islamist attacks on the Colombo, Batticaloa, and Negombo churches were attacks on a vibrant church that's growing by leaps and bounds. According to this Breitbart report, the growth of Christianity in Sri Lanka has been very important in breaking up the ethnic loyalties of Sri Lanka's home country of India (Hindu Tamils and Buddhist Sinhalese) and helping the country come together as one country. Obviously, this doesn't serve the aims of Islamic militants who thrive on conflict and chaos.


            ....

            According to the background reports, the terrorists who attacked this place of worship were likely Islamists, given that warnings about their intentions were given earlier. The Muslim community is only about 12% of the population there, but there were a certain number of ISIS recruits from, shockingly, prominent wealthy Muslim families. It's likely they are now the attackers. Rich people, attacking the poor? It sounds like someone's rice bowl is threatened, and with Sri Lanka a country that has seen growth by leaps and bounds, one can't help but wondering if there is a class warfare element to these attacks. A group of people is rising in the world. Another group is threatened. Some of the rich kids get terrorist training. It looks like this may be about more than just religion.

            But what stands out is that it was a attack on the good. Evil rarely attacks other evil, it has a partiality for attacking the good




            https://www.americanthinker.com/blog...s_so_evil.html

            ?


            • #7
              Originally posted by Captain Trips View Post
              Happy Easter..

              UnGodly people

              Killing each other for God...

              -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



              At Least 200 Dead in Easter Day Attacks on Sri Lankan Churches, Hotels

              ...

              Last year, there were 86 verified incidents of discrimination, threats and violence against Christians, according to the National Christian Evangelical Alliance of Sri Lanka (NCEASL), which represents more than 200 churches and other Christian organizations.

              This year, the NCEASL recorded 26 such incidents, including one in which Buddhist monks allegedly attempted to disrupt a Sunday worship service, with the last one reported on March 25.

              Out of Sri Lanka's total population of around 22 million, 70 percent are Buddhist, 12.6 percent Hindu, 9.7 percent Muslim and 7.6 percent Christian, according to the country's 2012 census

              In its 2018 report on Sri Lanka's human rights, the U.S. State Department noted that some Christian groups and churches reported they had been pressured to end worship meetings after authorities classified them as "unauthorized gatherings."

              The report also said Buddhist monks regularly tried to close down Christian and Muslim places of worship, citing unidentified sources.

              Malcolm Cardinal Ranjith, the archbishop of Colombo, told local TV that the public should remain calm and asked authorities to bring those responsible for the attacks before the law. He also requested the public donate blood for the injured.

              Education Minister Akila Viraj Kariyawasam announced that all schools would be closed on Monday and Tuesday.

              The heads of major governments condemned the attacks. Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi said "there is no place for such barbarism in our region." Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan said in a tweet that "this is an assault on all of humanity.



              https://www.newsmax.com/headline/sri.../21/id/912590/


              ....


              First, it was an attack on a place of worship, which is a disturbing trend, if you can call it that, among terrorists. For awhile there, they were doing shopping malls, and places of commerce. They've tried military targets. They've gone after places of transport. Now they are assaulting places of worship, which are easy and trusting places (try getting past security at, say, Goldman Sachs, compared to a church or synogogue), and because places of worship are full of people, where they can get large numbers of casualties, maximizing the shock factor, which they seek. We have already seen horrific such attacks by Muslim militants on Christians in Pakistan and Egypt, and on Jews in the United States and well beyond the U.S. Muslim terrorists aren't the only ones going after houses of worship - a stray crazy committed mass murder in mosques in New Zealand, another godless lowlife burned several black churches in the Deep South, and a maniac was caught with a gas can in St. Patrick's Cathedral on a day after the Notre Dame de Paris inferno, whose origins are still being investigated. There was also the monster who opened fire on the Sutherland Springs church in Texas in 2017, and the murderous attacker who targeted the Pittsburgh synogogue who was a Nazi. There's something awful about the growing attacks on peoples of faith, as if faith can't coexist in the modern world full of Internet-obsessed lunatics.

              The attacks on the Christians and Jews are notable because they are organized efforts, the work of Muslim militants, and they seem to be intensifying. Sadly, Islam itself is a petri dish for this, because it is a decentralized religion and with a lot of ancient thinking throughout its writings, which enables a lot of discontented miserable people of the modern world who feel like failures otherwise to read it the way they want to read it - sometimes murderously. The latest result is this Islamist attack in Sri Lanka on Christians on their holiest day of the year. And it's not the first of such Easter attacks - we have been horrified to see other Easter attacks on Christians in Egypt and elsewhere with very large numbers of casualties.

              What can we say about the specific attack on Sri Lanka? The Islamist attacks on the Colombo, Batticaloa, and Negombo churches were attacks on a vibrant church that's growing by leaps and bounds. According to this Breitbart report, the growth of Christianity in Sri Lanka has been very important in breaking up the ethnic loyalties of Sri Lanka's home country of India (Hindu Tamils and Buddhist Sinhalese) and helping the country come together as one country. Obviously, this doesn't serve the aims of Islamic militants who thrive on conflict and chaos.


              ....

              According to the background reports, the terrorists who attacked this place of worship were likely Islamists, given that warnings about their intentions were given earlier. The Muslim community is only about 12% of the population there, but there were a certain number of ISIS recruits from, shockingly, prominent wealthy Muslim families. It's likely they are now the attackers. Rich people, attacking the poor? It sounds like someone's rice bowl is threatened, and with Sri Lanka a country that has seen growth by leaps and bounds, one can't help but wondering if there is a class warfare element to these attacks. A group of people is rising in the world. Another group is threatened. Some of the rich kids get terrorist training. It looks like this may be about more than just religion.

              But what stands out is that it was a attack on the good. Evil rarely attacks other evil, it has a partiality for attacking the good




              https://www.americanthinker.com/blog...s_so_evil.html
              Of course we have the three black churches that were torched in Louisiana, but the Trump administration has no comment about them because the crimes were most likely perpetrated by white nationalists, but who knows it might have been Muslims.

              ?


              • #8
                Originally posted by redrover View Post

                Of course we have the three black churches that were torched in Louisiana, but the Trump administration has no comment about them because the crimes were most likely perpetrated by white nationalists, but who knows it might have been Muslims.
                Gee whiz. Democrats appear to have lost the ability or will, or both, to say the word Christianity.

                https://twitter.com/HillaryClinton/s...13694073810944

                For the New Zealand attack, specifically called out White Supremicists, but can't bring herself to speak 'Militant Radical Muslim extremists'. For fear of what? Being accused of Islamophobia or something?

                The fact of the matter is that world wide, Christians are the most attacked, most killed and maimed, of all religions.

                ?


                • #9
                  Originally posted by eohrnberger View Post

                  Gee whiz. Democrats appear to have lost the ability or will, or both, to say the word Christianity.

                  https://twitter.com/HillaryClinton/s...13694073810944

                  For the New Zealand attack, specifically called out White Supremicists, but can't bring herself to speak 'Militant Radical Muslim extremists'. For fear of what? Being accused of Islamophobia or something?

                  The fact of the matter is that world wide, Christians are the most attacked, most killed and maimed, of all religions.
                  You might be right, but why do you think everyone in the world hates Christians? I can't understand it It is such a loving religion. LOL.In my book there is not a dimes worth of difference between Islam and Christianity. I do believe that everyone should have the right to practice their superstition of choice. I hope you had a wonderful Easter

                  ?


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by redrover View Post
                    You might be right, but why do you think everyone in the world hates Christians?
                    Everyone in the world doesn't hate Christians.

                    Originally posted by redrover View Post
                    I can't understand it It is such a loving religion. LOL.In my book there is not a dimes worth of difference between Islam and Christianity.
                    That is because you know little or nothing about either.

                    Originally posted by redrover View Post
                    I do believe that everyone should have the right to practice their superstition of choice. I hope you had a wonderful Easter
                    That is a bigoted statement.

                    ?


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by redrover View Post

                      You might be right, but why do you think everyone in the world hates Christians? I can't understand it It is such a loving religion. LOL.In my book there is not a dimes worth of difference between Islam and Christianity. I do believe that everyone should have the right to practice their superstition of choice. I hope you had a wonderful Easter
                      Originally posted by Captain Trips View Post

                      Everyone in the world doesn't hate Christians.



                      That is because you know little or nothing about either.



                      That is a bigoted statement.
                      The Cap't has it. If this is your impression of either religion, pick up a Bible and / or Quran, and read them.

                      I've of the opinion that there's good and bad in both religions, that both religions have been co-opted by some to be used to commit unspeakable atrocities, in the name of their religion. It would appear that this period has passed, not to return, for Christendom, and that Islam and its followers have a way to go yet, and there were some 19,000 killed by Islamic radicals, and only some 66 by White Nationals.

                      Guess what? The White Nationals aren't the problem, and aren't causing the majority of the killing and maiming.

                      ?


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by eohrnberger View Post



                        The Cap't has it. If this is your impression of either religion, pick up a Bible and / or Quran, and read them.

                        I've of the opinion that there's good and bad in both religions, that both religions have been co-opted by some to be used to commit unspeakable atrocities, in the name of their religion. It would appear that this period has passed, not to return, for Christendom, and that Islam and its followers have a way to go yet, and there were some 19,000 killed by Islamic radicals, and only some 66 by White Nationals.

                        Guess what? The White Nationals aren't the problem, and aren't causing the majority of the killing and maiming.
                        It was a year ago that you guys shot up the Waffle House in Nashville and if you go back four years we have the shooting in Charleston. . https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ting/28902017/

                        ?


                        • #13
                          I wonder what a statistical analysis of the past 20 years of the number of killings by "white nationalists" VS the number of killings by Islamic fruits, would look like...

                          Might be interesting....

                          ?


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by redrover View Post

                            It was a year ago that you guys shot up the Waffle House in Nashville and if you go back four years we have the shooting in Charleston. . https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ting/28902017/
                            And the common thread being what? Exactly? That they were all mentally unstable, and I'm inclined to believe they had illegal weapons that they shouldn't have had in the first place.
                            So what sense does further firearms restrictions on legal and law abiding actually make? When criminals and the mentally unstable are the source of the problem?

                            ?

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