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Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

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  • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

    Originally posted by Disillusioned_1 View Post
    I have actually worked in Spain briefly for an American company. I was sent there for 2 weeks to help them with one of our products.

    All I can say is google "siesta".
    If that is what you got out of 2 weeks in Spain, you really didn't see Spain. There may be siestas, but the people go back to work and spend late hours to make up for it. They are a generally honest hard working and intelligent people with many skilled workers.



    Lol, I guess the same logic does not apply when Americans buy products. We could care less whether the products we buy benefit our labor pool? If we DO care, then perhaps you should look in the mirror, Mr "all American companies should ship all production overseas".
    I work for a multinational company which has manufacturing facilities all over the world selling to a market all over the world. If there had been enough good sense people who realized Obama was anti business maybe our new facility would be here. That was unfortunate, but since the purpose of my job is to make recommendations based on the bottom line it is my job to be truthful, not loyal to American workers. Do you suppose there were a couple of million union voters in Ohio, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Colorado and California who voted for Obama and sealed the fate of several thousand new jobs moving off shore?

    I just left a board meeting, went for a snack and now waiting for some contacts. The deal is done. The decision has been made, or should I say the American people effectively made our decision for us.

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    • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

      Originally posted by CowboyTed View Post
      Welll I have the equivalent to a BA in Macro Economics with my degree in Actuarial Maths and Statistics....

      So enlighten me were Romney's polices were better for business than Obama's....

      I expect Empirical Evidence to back your case...

      You made the statement, now prove it...
      In fact cowboy, I don't have to prove anything to you. In fact I have not ever given Romney much positive press and did not want him to be the nominee, but knowing Obama is anti business was reason enough and knowing that in general conservatives are far more business friendly I chose to vote for him. I really don't care about Romney's tax plans and they were never part of my decision as it is unlikely with a Democrat senate he would ever get them through. I always expected the Bush excessive cuts would be eliminated 1 Jan. so it was moot. Beyond that we have nothing to talk about.

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      • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

        Originally posted by jpn View Post
        Bullshit.

        Bull Shit.

        The most balanced look at the effects of the stimulus that I have been able to find is here There are a few studies that suggest no positive effect, but they are certainly in the minority and have significant problems.

        As for the president's policies being bad for business, just ask the auto workers how they feel about that. Check that, they already told us--at the ballot box.
        Did I talk about the stimulus? No! Should the auto workers be happy Obama bought them and the union off of bankruptcy? Of course! Was it good business to save one of our large defense industries? Absolutely! But not for the reasons you would accept and certainly not to bail out the UAW.

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        • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

          Originally posted by Disillusioned_1 View Post
          See its blanket statements like that, and where you then state that anybody running a company should have supported Romney, that are just factually too extreme to suggest any actual economic analysis. .
          Gee, this is a blanket statement? Or a very general statement. "Whether you want to believe it or not, Obama's anti business ideology are not good for the overall economy." Sounds very damned general to me, and not specific to every business and it requires no additional information to anyone who examines Obama's anti-business/entrepreneural attitudes, but mostly the instability of what he may do through regulatory agencies and fiat. As a business person he scares the hell out of me, thus I have been slowly disassociating myself from the US financially and socially.

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          • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

            Originally posted by jpn View Post
            Bullshit.

            Bull Shit.

            The most balanced look at the effects of the stimulus that I have been able to find is here There are a few studies that suggest no positive effect, but they are certainly in the minority and have significant problems.

            As for the president's policies being bad for business, just ask the auto workers how they feel about that. Check that, they already told us--at the ballot box.
            I suppose all additional expenses incurred by businesses in regulation compliance as well all the anti-business and class warfare rhetoric from the white house all just really didn't have an effect on the business climate? Is that the fairy tale you are telling us to believe?

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            • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

              Originally posted by CalifornCracker View Post
              Did I talk about the stimulus? No! Should the auto workers be happy Obama bought them and the union off of bankruptcy? Of course! Was it good business to save one of our large defense industries? Absolutely! But not for the reasons you would accept and certainly not to bail out the UAW.
              Interesting thought came to mind.

              The government bailed out GM and GM became government motors.
              The government proceeded to hand over the best possible deal to the UAW during the bankruptcy.

              Does that now mean that the UAW is a public sector union? And if so, don't the federal public sector union agreements apply?

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              • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

                Originally posted by jpn View Post
                Republicans had taking over the Senate in the bag. Most pundits expected the GOP to take three to six seats, or more.

                Republicans had 10 Senate seats up for grabs. Democrats had 23.

                How'd that work out?

                Democrats held ALL 23 SEATS, and took two of the Republicans' 10 seats.

                Wow. What a thrashing of the far right.
                The GOP is not the far right. They are the slightly right side of the Left.

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                • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

                  Divine rapists, the tea-party "movement" coopted and undermined by Republicans, and a rich elitist belonging to a strange cult who couldn't connect with the common man handed Obama his second term. Deeper analysis might review more details but I feel that sums it up pretty well.

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                  • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

                    Originally posted by ericams2786 View Post
                    The GOP is not the far right. They are the slightly right side of the Left.
                    The Republicans should stop pretending to be conservatives and accept non-loon conservatives while kicking the "neo-con" douchebags and the "our profit first" corporate oligarchs to the curb.

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                    • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

                      Originally posted by ericams2786 View Post
                      The GOP is not the far right. They are the slightly right side of the Left.
                      Good point, it's like football, where we line up on either side of the ball, and the left has pushed the ball a long way.
                      When you have Paul Ryan claiming to be protecting Medicare from the left, then it's cuckoo land.
                      And now you have the right working like a fiscal suicide bomber, threatening to blow up the national finances unless their demands are met, but they haven't worked out their demands yet.

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                      • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

                        Originally posted by goober View Post
                        Good point, it's like football, where we line up on either side of the ball, and the left has pushed the ball a long way.
                        When you have Paul Ryan claiming to be protecting Medicare from the left, then it's cuckoo land.
                        And now you have the right working like a fiscal suicide bomber, threatening to blow up the national finances unless their demands are met, but they haven't worked out their demands yet.
                        Anybody who objectively looks at Paul Ryan's record knows full well he is a Statist and far more to the Left than he is the TRUE Right. Again, I define the true Right as Classic Liberalism and free market ideology based on The Wealth of Nations, not someone in the GOP. The GOP began as a Statist party before the Civil War from the ashes of the earlier Whig Party and Henry Clay's "American System" (which Lincoln wholeheartedly embraced unlike his supposed affinity for hating slavery) and it was the GOP in the 19th Century that was largely responsible for turning the country from a federation of Sovereign States into a "centralized nation" during Reconstruction. It wasn't until after the Democrat Grover Cleveland (a small government, hard currency, low taxes, laissez-faire, Classic Liberal by the way) left office during the time William Jennings Bryan was challenging the Democrats, that the GOP switched places with the Dems and became the current conception of what they claim to be - that is - what the Dems were in the 19th century. That was during a time that the GOP was truly small government and "Mr. Republican" Robert A. Taft was the intellectualy leader of conservatism in the Congress. Of course the old Northeastern establishment liberal Republican "Statists" still existed, folks like Rockefeller, who challenged the conservative wing. Then of course, in the 1970's, an obscure offshoot of the DEMOCRATIC party, disillusioned with the "New Left's" "peaceful/anti-war" foreign policy, started a group within the DEMOCRATIC party called the Neo-Conservatives who then moved to the GOP during the "Reagan Revolution". And of course the Neo-cons are nothing but Statists.

                        So there you have it. The GOP did not start as a "fiscally conservative, small government, constitutionalist" party and wasn't for decades after its creation, and only was during the New Deal era, before abruptly becoming more and more Statist and Progressive throughout the 20th Century.

                        Honesly, I don't understand why modern liberals hate the GOP so much besides the Evangelical/extreme religious folks. Then again those folks have been around since the 1820's, also pushing "big government" schemes, so again I don't understand where the conflict is with liberals.

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                        • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

                          Originally posted by JDJarvis View Post
                          The Republicans should stop pretending to be conservatives and accept non-loon conservatives while kicking the "neo-con" douchebags and the "our profit first" corporate oligarchs to the curb.
                          Agreed. Th same way that the Democrats should kick out their far left loons. The moderates that would be left would be in a position to actually work out some compromises and get something done for a change.

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                          • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

                            Originally posted by eohrnberger View Post
                            Agreed. Th same way that the Democrats should kick out their far left loons. The moderates that would be left would be in a position to actually work out some compromises and get something done for a change.
                            What would you have the government do. All I want them to do is get the heck out of the way.

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                            • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

                              Originally posted by OldmanDan View Post
                              What would you have the government do. All I want them to do is get the heck out of the way.
                              But the government won't "get out of the way" until we elect someone who actually believes in that philosophy in his/her words and deeds. We had such an individual, now he is gone.

                              On another note for my conservative friends on here: How can we expect the government to "get out of the way and out of our personal business" if we don't expect the government to "get out of the personal business" of foreign governments and people overseas?

                              Not trying to start an argument - just a simple question. To me these things go hand and hand.

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                              • Re: Election Day 2012 - Results Discussion Thread

                                Originally posted by jpn View Post
                                Bullshit.

                                Bull Shit.

                                The most balanced look at the effects of the stimulus that I have been able to find is here There are a few studies that suggest no positive effect, but they are certainly in the minority and have significant problems.

                                As for the president's policies being bad for business, just ask the auto workers how they feel about that. Check that, they already told us--at the ballot box.
                                Originally posted by eohrnberger View Post
                                I suppose all additional expenses incurred by businesses in regulation compliance as well all the anti-business and class warfare rhetoric from the white house all just really didn't have an effect on the business climate? Is that the fairy tale you are telling us to believe?
                                I suppose that JPN isn't around right now.

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