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  • #16
    Originally posted by Good1 View Post

    ANCIENT history, homey. I have no deed to deny it: It is irrelevant today. You, on the other hand, cannot seem to put the letters "GOP" into a sentence without spittle forming at the corners of your mouth and some hatred slithering out of your keyboard.

    Give it up: This is not your father's GOP.

    I don't read most of your posts (for the above reason), so if you have recently called Clinton treasonous, I didn't catch it. the letters "GOP" in that sequence jump off a page more noticeably than the letters "Clinton" in your larger posts so they catch my eye and I read that sentence and, then, respond. It is almost always some level of anger at or hatred of the dreaded "GOP."

    Who cares what the GOP was in your youth: More ancient history with which you clearly still feel compelled to paint the whole party.
    Ancient history is pertinent, for it is what led to the creation of TODAY. And it shows, that the path taken, away from the FDR New Deal path, has hollowed out America, and yet these same policies are still in effect today, and we add to them, staying within the same paradigm that created the disaster for working americans and the middle class.. So you do not get to dismiss it, as merely ancient history. Unless we see just how screwed up it was, and still is, it will continue on, for you will not vote to change it. Nor most conservatives. For after all, it came from conservatives. And going by the GOP vote on giving Obama the authority on tpp, it is still coming from the conservatives, although as I have said many times, the democrats on this issue are in step with the GOP. And have been since Clinton. Just about the only thing the GOP has not tried to obstruct Obama on, is this new free trade agreement. So, they are as much for it, as they were in the 90s, and as they were when it was concocted under the Bush admin, in collusion with MNCs and the banking cabal.

    The GOP used to have some good, non treasonous men in it. And the democratic party to represent working people, as that was the primary constituent. It was a good balance, the GOP, the party of big business, of wall street, even back then, main street, while the dems represented the economic interests of the working and middle class. Now, neither party represents the average guy, when it comes to his economic interests...or in short, having a job so he can live a decent life with his family. For sending millions of living wage jobs to a communist state, was never in the best interest of the People. But it did not matter, did it?

    So yeah, I get spitting mad any time I think of the regular conservatives in the GOP and then the far right conservative extremists that is now a part of the GOP. In order to match that on the democratic side, to get extreme, the democratic party would have to have an equal sized contingent that were actually pressing for real deal communism, or real deal socialism, where capitalism was destroyed, and the gov't assumed ownership of what is now a capitalistic private sector. That some cons accuse these capitalists on the democratic side who want some collective driven programs while still being market capitalism, of being communists...is actually exhibiting what you are attempting to accuse me of doing.

    Give it up? Not my father's GOP? Of course it isn't. This GOP would have no place for men like Ike, and that shows you just how batshit crazy the GOP has become. The GOP is in quest of purity, and anytime you see that, one thinks of other movements that sought purity, and ostrasized moderates. My dad's GOP had moderates, liberals, and conservatives. And when we had that, the American people, did well as a whole under them. This purity is a damned sickness, and we can thank Reagan for that as well, as bringing back failed, 1920s neoliberalism to this nation. The proof is always in the pudding, and the pudding is there, and so is the proof.

    As I have said before, the GOP is not to be blamed solely. For if the democrats had remained representing the people they used to represent, they could have fought this neoliberalism, and at least tempered it somewhat, and then moving away from it when they had the oval office and the congress. But they acted like neoliberals when they had it, thereby committing treason on the American people. The bones they toss America, are like what the GOP tosses....scraps.

    ?


    • #17
      Originally posted by Good1 View Post
      ANCIENT history, homey. I have no deed to deny it: It is irrelevant today. You, on the other hand, cannot seem to put the letters "GOP" into a sentence without spittle forming at the corners of your mouth and some hatred slithering out of your keyboard.

      Give it up: This is not your father's GOP.

      I don't read most of your posts (for the above reason), so if you have recently called Clinton treasonous, I didn't catch it. the letters "GOP" in that sequence jump off a page more noticeably than the letters "Clinton" in your larger posts so they catch my eye and I read that sentence and, then, respond. It is almost always some level of anger at or hatred of the dreaded "GOP."

      Who cares what the GOP was in your youth: More ancient history with which you clearly still feel compelled to paint the whole party.
      Let's hope the gop can get us back to where we SHOULD be. . if they can get their acts together enough to be effective against the criminals in the democratic "party."

      Both "parties" have been destroying America for a VERY long time and they need to be stopped.

      I hope/think we have reached our limit of what kind of foolishness we're willing to tolerate from our "officials" - these people that supposedly WORK FOR US. . . that has been turned upside-down.

      I hope/think we learned something important from Mr. "O" and his wife, this pair that told us what their intentions were . .

      Barack Obama just days before his election in 2008:

      “We are five days away from fundamentally transforming the United States of America.”

      His wife Michelle: “We are going to have to change our conversation,” she said. “[W]e’re going to have to change our traditions, our history; we’re going to have to move into a different place as a nation.”

      http://www.americanthinker.com/artic...er_before.html

      Do we want to allow and KEEP this man and his wife's "fundamental transformation" of our country ?

      Are we going to keep allowing our traditions and values to be turned into utter foolishness ?

      Are we going to continue allowing ourselves to be engaged in and talking about insane ideas, as if they were thoughtful, honest and relevant ?


      Do people really think you can just turn the world upside down without having any adverse effects?

      We have come to a place of semantic insanity – where you can have ....


      http://www.onenewsnow.com/perspectiv...oom-in-florida

      ?


      • #18
        Originally posted by Blue Doggy View Post


        I wonder why that is? On my pc, the picture itself shows up. Perhaps the problem is in the settings of your pc? Not like I would know, as I am basically still a neophyte when it comes to pcs. I still use a flip phone as the smart phones just look too intimidating for this analog mind living in a digital world. If I could recall the site it was posted on, I would gladly give you that link so you could go there to view it.
        Okay, so here's the oddest thing. When I click on the link in your post #1, the area the pic is supposed to be in is blank. But I clicked on the same link in post #2 and it shows up. Go figure!

        Anyway, Yes, it's creepy. The posting of it of course is intentional, but Obama's positioning at the time, is not orchestrated. However I do believe in coincidence. I do think Obama may be the Devil, but not because of this pic. lol.

        But then again maybe that psychiatrist is right. "There are no coincidences"!
        http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/8045...ith-stupid.jpg

        But in the link it say's it's photo shopped.

        It most likely is photoshopped, but for my entertainment value I'm going to believe, the claimed original is the one photoshopped. LOL!

        http://shark1053.com/is-this-picture...rt-in-nh-real/

        ?


        • #19
          Originally posted by Blue Doggy View Post


          The GOP used to have some good, non treasonous men in it. And the democratic party to represent working people, as that was the primary constituent. It was a good balance, the GOP, the party of big business, of wall street, even back then, main street, while the dems represented the economic interests of the working and middle class.
          Well, how far back in History will we go. The Dems supported slavery and the Republican party was more or less formed to oppose slavery.

          But I guess a lot of the understanding and interpretation of events has to do with age. I gained my initial, information from my father who was born in the 1930's. He served in Germany, (post war). As my interest peaked, I debated with and learned from him. I value his understanding because he was a very intelligent, wise, strong, level headed, kind, moral, compassionate, and fair man. His values sometimes held him back from financial advancement, but he never regretted any moral decision. He believed himself to be rich even though he was typical middle class that prospered from lower class/poor. These positive traits, even when he was younger, are much greater than my own. He was a Democrat for good reason, then became a Republican for good reason, but always pointed out the problems with both parties. He was not blind to corruption within either party. And also shared, what he believed to be bad ideas in both parties. He voted for a Democrat in some non presidential elections, when the Republican running was, as he put it, a bum. Even declined from voting at times. Not married to either party in his voting record or theories.

          I was born in the 60's, so my experience only goes so far. And since My father has passed, 7 years ago, there are so many questions I would like to ask him and get his view, but no longer have that luxury. My understandings of the times between the 30's and 60's are strongly based on my fathers experience and passed on knowledge. Because of my strong admiration for this man, a man liked by most and respected by all, I believe his information to be accurate and agree with his calculations. (99% of the time). I'm sure if he were here today, you, BD, would enjoy a good debate with him. I even believe you would find common ground on your beliefs of what took place, yet quite sure you'd disagree often with the reasons why, and how to handle the situations. And I'm sure he'd understand much better than myself, why you believe as you do.

          My point is that, yes, times have changed. Things today don't mean what they meant yesterday. And I understand this in depth because of my Father. We can't forget or ignore the knowledge passed on to us from each generation, because we will come to a point where we are so far removed from the reality of the past, and will not be able to advance our future but instead go full circle.

          I know I diverted a bit from the topic of your comment, but when I think of my Dad in relation to an issue, I occasionally am compelled to voice my deep respect for him. My mind drifts to all of his amazing qualities he had/has, that I have never seen combined in another man, or woman. For me, it's always the right time and place to give props to my day. My necessity is not so much for you to hear it, but it's important to me to say it. Hope I didn't bore you too much.
          Last edited by msc; 09-29-2015, 04:14 AM.

          ?


          • #20
            Originally posted by msc View Post

            Well, how far back in History will we go. The Dems supported slavery and the Republican party was more or less formed to oppose slavery.

            But I guess a lot of the understanding and interpretation of events has to do with age. I gained my initial, information from my father who was born in the 1930's. He served in Germany, (post war). As my interest peaked, I debated with and learned from him. I value his understanding because he was a very intelligent, wise, strong, level headed, kind, moral, compassionate, and fair man. His values sometimes held him back from financial advancement, but he never regretted any moral decision. He believed himself to be rich even though he was typical middle class that prospered from lower class/poor. These positive traits, even when he was younger, are much greater than my own. He was a Democrat for good reason, then became a Republican for good reason, but always pointed out the problems with both parties. He was not blind to corruption within either party. And also shared, what he believed to be bad ideas in both parties. He voted for a Democrat in some non presidential elections, when the Republican running was, as he put it, a bum. Even declined from voting at times. Not married to either party in his voting record or theories.

            I was born in the 60's, so my experience only goes so far. And since My father has passed, 7 years ago, there are so many questions I would like to ask him and get his view, but no longer have that luxury. My understandings of the times between the 30's and 60's are strongly based on my fathers experience and passed on knowledge. Because of my strong admiration for this man, a man liked by most and respected by all, I believe his information to be accurate and agree with his calculations. (99% of the time). I'm sure if he were here today, you, BD, would enjoy a good debate with him. I even believe you would find common ground on your beliefs of what took place, yet quite sure you'd disagree often with the reasons why, and how to handle the situations. And I'm sure he'd understand much better than myself, why you believe as you do.

            My point is that, yes, times have changed. Things today don't mean what they meant yesterday. And I understand this in depth because of my Father. We can't forget or ignore the knowledge passed on to us from each generation, because we will come to a point where we are so far removed from the reality of the past, and will not be able to advance our future but instead go full circle.

            I know I diverted a bit from the topic of your comment, but when I think of my Dad in relation to an issue, I occasionally am compelled to voice my deep respect for him. My mind drifts to all of his amazing qualities he had/has, that I have never seen combined in another man, or woman. For me, it's always the right time and place to give props to my day. My necessity is not so much for you to hear it, but it's important to me to say it. Hope I didn't bore you too much.
            In so far as, how far to go back, I speak only from my own lifeline, and then the information conveyed to me in regards to my own father's life line.. And from coming from the fact that the Greatest Generation, as Brokaw called them, raised me, and their values were imparted to me.

            My own views are of course grounded in my own life line, the observations of perceptions which cannot be scrubbed completely free of subjectivity. I understand that fact.

            But there is absolutely nothing subjective about what a group of elites have wrought upon the American people, in trying to satiate their own greed. I watched this happen in real time. And was not only puzzled but greatly alarmed at what they, along with the American gov't, which is composed of elected represenatives, wanted to do to our economic model, and then greatly succeeded in pulling it off, as America seemed to have went into a great slumber, oblivious to the inevitable consequence of changing what FDR, dems and repubs, put into place, after the crash of 29 and the ensuring great depression.

            We must remember a hard fact when it comes to FDR. He was one of the existing oligarchs. But in fear of a revolution, he took on those oligarchs, forcing them basically into relenting some of their greed, in order to stabilize America, her millions of suffering jobless people. This is the fact of the matter, which for some reason the modern conservative neoliberal chooses to ignore, or worse, to insist that this never happened, when indeed it is a historical fact

            I think a good case can be made for the existence of a cycle that happens now in America. We see the rise of the power of the oligarchs, or the elites, who through the power of their wealth, change our economic model to only benefit their own wealth building, which creates a great disparity in wealth and income, which translates into human suffering of the dirtied masses, and this creates a reaction, which if not addressed as FDR did it, brings about some sort of revolution. That is what FDR rationally feared. And at least so far, it seems to require one of the elites in order to take on the greed of the other elites. And it seems to take one of the elites that has the intelligence to understand the great downside of a small group of people exercising their greed upon an economic model which is benefitting the People, but of course means it keeps the elites from maxing out profits, and their own wealth. Now, this observation is an accurate one, IMO. It is not driven by some wild eyed communist, for I am not a communist but a capitalist. I just, unlike some people, understand that we have seen two forms of capitalism. The FDR model and the neoliberal model, brought back by the GOP.

            That anyone could disagree that the GOP, starting with Reagan, brought back an older model, but was able to add the misnomer of free trade to it, which was an injection of steroids, is just utter nonsense. And that is what some conservative GOP voters are trying to insist. Perhaps, if they had to admit the fact, they would lose a part of their own self image, which is defined by being able to call themselves a conservative? One has to look for reasons, given the utter absurdity of what many conservatives try to do. For otherwise, it makes no sense at all to me.

            Good1, seems to be in this group, who refuses to acknowledge what his party and the ideology he accepted, has wrought, with the great help of a democratic party that joined in with the GOP conservative neoliberalism. When I go after these people, he accuses me of hyperbole, and a list of other choice, negatively implied, terms. I do not know where he thinks neoliberal, free trade, globalization originated from, and perhaps it just descended upon man from God Himself? Well, it is obvious where it came from, yet he does not like it, when the fact of the matter is stated.

            The fact that trump and sanders are getting the support that they are getting, is due to the economic suffering of many of the voters. And that suffering is rooted not in some socialistic democratic conspiracy, but in it's opposite, a neoliberal fascism which can be called an oligarchy. And it dismantled the FDR model, that was instituted in order to save the capitalism of the 1920s, after 20 years of repub rule, which embraced the neoliberalism of the 20s. And so now with the return of neoliberalism, it should be no surprise that we had another financial led crash, which could not of happened under the FDR regulated banking system, which also gave us the too big to fail banking cabal. Which gave us a recession, in which we no longer had the manufacturing base to use, to put people back to work. So, when the people started going back to work, it was in the service sector, low paying, part time jobs, which americans have to work more than one of in order just to survive, while straining our safety nets, that were never intended to be used by deindustrializing America, removing the right of our people to make what they consume.

            In no way is this "take" this perception, driven by someone who desires real socialism nor communism. It is a perception that shows the hard fact of the matter, and can well remember when our economic model served the People, and can observe today, how it no longer does that. And then asks the question, how did we get here? How we got here is not at all difficult to see, for it is right there in recent history. It is out in the open, for the looking. And if anyone was paying any attention, they saw it happening. But you have people, who will simply not accept the facts, and attack anyone who lays those facts out. If what I say can be refuted by facts, then by all means, use those facts, and I am the kinda guy that will admit I was wrong, or that I made an error. You will not see this from many forum members, who are hard ideologues. Which is so common if one listens to CTR. Which I do every night on my radio. These people on CTR do exactly what I am accused of doing. I am not given facts to tear apart my assertions. Name calling takes its place. Just like on CTR.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Captain Trips View Post

              Let's hope the gop can get us back to where we SHOULD be. . if they can get their acts together enough to be effective against the criminals in the democratic "party."

              Both "parties" have been destroying America for a VERY long time and they need to be stopped.

              I hope/think we have reached our limit of what kind of foolishness we're willing to tolerate from our "officials" - these people that supposedly WORK FOR US. . . that has been turned upside-down.

              I hope/think we learned something important from Mr. "O" and his wife, this pair that told us what their intentions were . .

              Barack Obama just days before his election in 2008:

              “We are five days away from fundamentally transforming the United States of America.”

              His wife Michelle: “We are going to have to change our conversation,” she said. “[W]e’re going to have to change our traditions, our history; we’re going to have to move into a different place as a nation.”

              http://www.americanthinker.com/artic...er_before.html

              Do we want to allow and KEEP this man and his wife's "fundamental transformation" of our country ?

              Are we going to keep allowing our traditions and values to be turned into utter foolishness ?

              Are we going to continue allowing ourselves to be engaged in and talking about insane ideas, as if they were thoughtful, honest and relevant ?


              Do people really think you can just turn the world upside down without having any adverse effects?

              We have come to a place of semantic insanity – where you can have ....


              http://www.onenewsnow.com/perspectiv...oom-in-florida
              Agreed, most of us have been saying this for a long time. I doubt the current leadership can accomplish that, but there is still a viable cadre of legislators who are interested in moving us back to where we were before this "change we can 'believe in'." Getting rid of Boehner will be a step in the right direction but I'm not so sure Kevin McCarthy will be the appropriate replacement.

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