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Pay Raises At The Gap

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  • #16
    Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

    Originally posted by jet57 View Post
    Minimum wage was the field of teenagers doing part time work and working in the summer. As immigration increased (from Mexico and the Phillippines) minimum wage jobs became careers and young kids, just like with paper routes, got pushed out of the market. So now the minimum wage has necessarily become a living wage.
    Yeah, I recall when min wage mostly applied to kids, but with the great changes in our economic model, those min wages are now for adults.

    I managed a McDs while doing my last year or so in college, and most of our employees were kids. Min wage jobs. Yet we had a core of older people, and they were never hired in at min wage. We actually barely paid them enough to survive on without having to resort to safety nets. The fast food places here no longer employ kids. For there are too many grown ups seeking those jobs now. And the kids are not seeking them, as it's a "McJob" and frowned upon. So these adults are paid a dime or two above minimum and are on social safety nets. That is reality.

    As a store mgr. at Mcd's in the early 70s, I made 22 grand a year. If you adjust for inflation, those same managers are not making what I made. WHY? The wages of workers have decreased as min wage is not adjusted up to what it would be if you adjusted the 1968 rates.

    מה מכילות החדשות?


    • #17
      Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

      Originally posted by Blue Doggy View Post
      Yeah, I recall when min wage mostly applied to kids, but with the great changes in our economic model, those min wages are now for adults.

      I managed a McDs while doing my last year or so in college, and most of our employees were kids. Min wage jobs. Yet we had a core of older people, and they were never hired in at min wage. We actually barely paid them enough to survive on without having to resort to safety nets. The fast food places here no longer employ kids. For there are too many grown ups seeking those jobs now. And the kids are not seeking them, as it's a "McJob" and frowned upon. So these adults are paid a dime or two above minimum and are on social safety nets. That is reality.

      As a store mgr. at Mcd's in the early 70s, I made 22 grand a year. If you adjust for inflation, those same managers are not making what I made. WHY? The wages of workers have decreased as min wage is not adjusted up to what it would be if you adjusted the 1968 rates.
      And yet, in spite of me telling you over and over, and over again... you still don't know why.

      Why are adults holding minimum wage jobs?

      BECAUSE THEY HAVE MINIMUM WAGE SKILLS!

      מה מכילות החדשות?


      • #18
        Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

        Originally posted by tsquare View Post
        And yet, in spite of me telling you over and over, and over again... you still don't know why.

        Why are adults holding minimum wage jobs?

        BECAUSE THEY HAVE MINIMUM WAGE SKILLS!
        Or they were laid off after 20-30 years in their industry and they still need to eat.

        מה מכילות החדשות?


        • #19
          Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

          Originally posted by JDJarvis View Post
          Or they were laid off after 20-30 years in their industry and they still need to eat.
          And what did they do for that 20-30 years in their industry?

          If they spent 20-30 years, and after that, all they can do is work at McDonnell's... THEY HAVE MINIMUM WAGE SKILLS!

          That said... good for them that they are doing something... far better that, than doing nothing. And if they are working at McDonnell's for a short time while re-training, so much the better.

          But... if they or anyone else thinks that McDonnell's is or should be a replacement for a high-skill high pay job, then they are batshit crazy.

          מה מכילות החדשות?


          • #20
            Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

            Originally posted by Blue Doggy View Post
            So when anyone starts a new job, in certain sectors, we get around paying them enough to live on, and to do this, we invent the term, "level entry pay"...

            The absurdity of it is obvious. It does take some intelligence to question this, and most times we just accept it. That is not how I ran my own business, for when someone showed up and needed a job, I didn't have the heart or immorality, to pay the guy less than it takes to live. For he was there, in order to work to in order to survive, on his own, without help from taxpayers.

            The paradigm forced upon working people has got to change, into something that resembles common decency. Now I know, capitalism has been scrubbed clean of decency and morality, for you can make greater profits the other way, but that's much of the problem.

            If society doesn't treat people fairly, decently, you get more problems than you can ever solve, in so many areas.
            As I said, if you are making minimum wage and you are not in school or a teenager you have to take a real hard look in the mirror and ask yourself why. Just on a lark I sent out 3 resume's last week to see what I would get. I only omitted that I owned my business. I was called by one person asking me to come in for an interview. If you are 40 and working a minimum wage job as your primary income, there is something wrong with either your skill set or you not the job market. There are so many options besides making minimum when an out of school adult. Unless of course you major in philosophy of basket weaving or similar idiotic major that has maybe 1 possible opening a decade. I have not made minimum wage since my first job and I have been through ups and downs economically. Then again, I don't whine and expect someone wipe my ass and determine my life. Too many would be much happier in prison, 3 squares, a reasonably comfortable bed, internet access everything but the key to the cell doors, health care. Hell it would be cheaper than welfare.

            Additionally reading why you sold your business, I can only wonder why you didn't just make sure there was a competent manager. I sure hope you got enough to survive on. Though I do know a Teacher depending on the State makes a damn good pension depending on 20 or 30 years in.

            מה מכילות החדשות?


            • #21
              Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

              Originally posted by Blue Doggy View Post
              Yeah, I recall when min wage mostly applied to kids, but with the great changes in our economic model, those min wages are now for adults.

              I managed a McDs while doing my last year or so in college, and most of our employees were kids. Min wage jobs. Yet we had a core of older people, and they were never hired in at min wage. We actually barely paid them enough to survive on without having to resort to safety nets. The fast food places here no longer employ kids. For there are too many grown ups seeking those jobs now. And the kids are not seeking them, as it's a "McJob" and frowned upon. So these adults are paid a dime or two above minimum and are on social safety nets. That is reality.

              As a store mgr. at Mcd's in the early 70s, I made 22 grand a year. If you adjust for inflation, those same managers are not making what I made. WHY? The wages of workers have decreased as min wage is not adjusted up to what it would be if you adjusted the 1968 rates.
              So what you are saying is that you are ignoring the many links in the past year I have posted that proves that about 1% of the people earning minimum wage are doing so to pay for their families to survive. The studies are out there on what percentage of people are actually making minimum and the largest chunk is age 16 to 25. The next largest are those working a second job for more income then the percentages which also in turn are actual numbers are tiny.

              Plus in my previous comment you ignore the ulterior motive of the Unions supporting this. They really don't care if some 18 year old makes 8 or 15/hr they care that increasing that will increase their paycheck.

              מה מכילות החדשות?


              • #22
                Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

                Originally posted by tsquare View Post
                And yet, in spite of me telling you over and over, and over again... you still don't know why.

                Why are adults holding minimum wage jobs?

                BECAUSE THEY HAVE MINIMUM WAGE SKILLS!
                That is a ridiculous talking point. Minimum wage jobs are full of skilled people who cannot find work in their fields becasue corporate America is harding all their money. Wages in this country have been driven down to the point of being just over minimum wage; a fact which I have shown over and again in these threads.

                I think you're just being a contrarious to save your ideology.

                מה מכילות החדשות?


                • #23
                  Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

                  Originally posted by OldmanDan View Post
                  Would you purchase stock in a company that was not concerned with making a profit?
                  Where did I suggest that a company that paid above the average is not concerned with making a profit?
                  In the UK we have 2 perfect examples of companies that pay staff above the going rate and are huve successes with lots of investors

                  Marks & Spencer
                  The Co-op

                  Both are huge companies with large profits so yes people do invest in companies with good ethical pay standards.

                  מה מכילות החדשות?


                  • #24
                    Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

                    Originally posted by jet57 View Post
                    That is a ridiculous talking point. Minimum wage jobs are full of skilled people who cannot find work in their fields becasue corporate America is harding all their money. Wages in this country have been driven down to the point of being just over minimum wage; a fact which I have shown over and again in these threads.

                    I think you're just being a contrarious to save your ideology.
                    I've worked in a warehouse with a couple of polish guys whose previous job was technicians at a nuclear power plant and they both had Phd's.

                    מה מכילות החדשות?


                    • #25
                      Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

                      Originally posted by PeterUK75 View Post
                      I've worked in a warehouse with a couple of polish guys whose previous job was technicians at a nuclear power plant and they both had Phd's.
                      Thank the environmentalists for them not being able to find a job. As polandball would say: Kurwa!

                      מה מכילות החדשות?


                      • #26
                        Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

                        Originally posted by reality View Post
                        Thank the environmentalists for them not being able to find a job. As polandball would say: Kurwa!
                        The reason they were with us had sod all to do with environmentalism and everything to do with them getting more money in the UK than Poland.

                        מה מכילות החדשות?


                        • #27
                          Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

                          Originally posted by tsquare View Post
                          And what did they do for that 20-30 years in their industry?

                          If they spent 20-30 years, and after that, all they can do is work at McDonnell's... THEY HAVE MINIMUM WAGE SKILLS!

                          That said... good for them that they are doing something... far better that, than doing nothing. And if they are working at McDonnell's for a short time while re-training, so much the better.

                          But... if they or anyone else thinks that McDonnell's is or should be a replacement for a high-skill high pay job, then they are batshit crazy.
                          You are out of touch with reality. There are plenty of people who were once earing 60K+ that have been forced to take any job possble because of the economic downturn. How the hell do you "re-train" while pushing burgers? Where's the money for that coming from?
                          Last edited by JDJarvis; 06-24-2014, 07:05 PM.

                          מה מכילות החדשות?


                          • #28
                            Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

                            Originally posted by PeterUK75 View Post
                            I've worked in a warehouse with a couple of polish guys whose previous job was technicians at a nuclear power plant and they both had Phd's.
                            Right. That's the part that the cons don't want to talk about. For them the world is strictly a one way street that is pro business: it's like a cult; well, it is a cult. There are so many graduates in the US with huuuuge student debt and no party to go to. The cons, actually - []intentionally[/i] - ignore that reality. It's the only reasonable conclusion that can be reached.

                            They live in this fire circle . . .

                            מה מכילות החדשות?


                            • #29
                              Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

                              I have an aunt with a 50 year old degree in architecture. She is wicked intelligent, but doesn't have a bit of common sense. After she divorced, she did nothing but survival type jobs. She lives like a hippy outside of Austin. Some people just can't live up to their potential.

                              Good for the Gap employees. The Gap should pay what they want. Paying more will keep more qualified people working by competition for the higher wages. Minimum wage is not meant to be a permanent status and anybody not moving up past minimum wage is not working very hard.

                              מה מכילות החדשות?


                              • #30
                                Re: Pay Raises At The Gap

                                Originally posted by Texan View Post
                                I have an aunt with a 50 year old degree in architecture. She is wicked intelligent, but doesn't have a bit of common sense. After she divorced, she did nothing but survival type jobs. She lives like a hippy outside of Austin. Some people just can't live up to their potential.

                                Good for the Gap employees. The Gap should pay what they want. Paying more will keep more qualified people working by competition for the higher wages. Minimum wage is not meant to be a permanent status and anybody not moving up past minimum wage is not working very hard.
                                Your aunt is enlightened: you should appreciate her and learn.

                                מה מכילות החדשות?

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