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Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

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  • #16
    Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

    Originally posted by jotathought View Post
    What a novel concept: congestion is prevelant in urban areas
    So why not have more polling places in urban areas?
    Why is it that if there is a Republican Secretary of State, urban polling places tend to be few and far between?

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    • #17
      Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

      Originally posted by goober View Post
      So why not have more polling places in urban areas?
      Why is it that if there is a Republican Secretary of State, urban polling places tend to be few and far between?
      Polls cost money. Unlike the Federal government, most states have to constrain themselves to spending money that they actually have....

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      • #18
        Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

        Originally posted by goober View Post
        So why not have more polling places in urban areas?
        Why is it that if there is a Republican Secretary of State, urban polling places tend to be few and far between?
        Are you saying there are no voting lines in Democrat controlled states?

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        • #19
          Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

          You've got to be kidding me! Disenfranchised, my ass. Give an example of how minorities are disenfranchised as it pertains to ability to vote. I bet you can't. Just a sweeping accusation that has no merit. What's the difference between a line at the voting booth and a line out of the store on Black Friday? People will camp through thanksgiving to buy a new tv, but think they can't wait 5 minutes to vote. Like anything else, if you want something or want to do something, you make accomodations to do it. Plain and simple. The only disenfranchisement I see, is the Democrats pander to minorities and tell them a stack of lies to give the impression that they are fighting for them, just to get their vote. What do you think immigration reform is about. Votes. Nothing more, and now the republicans are caving into it, because their eyeing new potential voters too.

          Originally posted by noahath View Post
          Did you actually read the article you cited? It said "Several recent polls and studies suggest that long waiting times in some places depressed turnout in 2012 and that lines were longest in cities, where Democrats outnumber Republicans."

          I'm 100% certain that voters from both party affiliations were affected, but the Dems are often more affected because many of their voters tend to be more disenfranchised, such as African Americans and Hispanics. The issue is exacerbated by the fact that elections are supervised in each state via a partisan process: the chief elections officer in each state is the Secretary of State, which in all but a few states is a state-wide elected partisan position. When the chief elections officer is an elected official from one party, then of course they're going to do what they can to aid their own party win elections. IMO it's a fundamental flaw in the democratic process of the US election system. The FEC needs to be given full authority over all US elections, including the setting of congressional districts. It's the only way to be truly democratic, and not just in name only.

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          • #20
            Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

            Originally posted by buck84 View Post
            You've got to be kidding me! Disenfranchised, my ass. Give an example of how minorities are disenfranchised as it pertains to ability to vote. I bet you can't. Just a sweeping accusation that has no merit. What's the difference between a line at the voting booth and a line out of the store on Black Friday? People will camp through thanksgiving to buy a new tv, but think they can't wait 5 minutes to vote. Like anything else, if you want something or want to do something, you make accomodations to do it. Plain and simple. The only disenfranchisement I see, is the Democrats pander to minorities and tell them a stack of lies to give the impression that they are fighting for them, just to get their vote. What do you think immigration reform is about. Votes. Nothing more, and now the republicans are caving into it, because their eyeing new potential voters too.
            Minorities tend to be far more disenfranchised, which is why the Supreme Court had to mandate majority-minority congressional districts (which I don't agree with, or support) to ensure they were able to achieve a represenative voice in Congress.

            However, the last point you make is a terrific one. As you say, people are prepared to wait in line for hours or days to get a new tv, iphone etc, but not a few hours to vote. At the same time though, if the political process was truly about egtting people to engage in the voting process then they would look to avenues to decrease wait times. As I said earlier, the reason they don't is that both sides try to do what they can to ensure that voters from the opposite major party don't vote. It's what happens (as I said) when the chief elections officer in each state is a partisan official. The current electoral process is absolutely not democratic in the true sense of the word.

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            • #21
              Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

              Originally posted by noahath View Post
              Did you actually read the article you cited? It said "Several recent polls and studies suggest that long waiting times in some places depressed turnout in 2012 and that lines were longest in cities, where Democrats outnumber Republicans."

              I'm 100% certain that voters from both party affiliations were affected, but the Dems are often more affected because many of their voters tend to be more disenfranchised, such as African Americans and Hispanics. The issue is exacerbated by the fact that elections are supervised in each state via a partisan process: the chief elections officer in each state is the Secretary of State, which in all but a few states is a state-wide elected partisan position. When the chief elections officer is an elected official from one party, then of course they're going to do what they can to aid their own party win elections. IMO it's a fundamental flaw in the democratic process of the US election system. The FEC needs to be given full authority over all US elections, including the setting of congressional districts. It's the only way to be truly democratic, and not just in name only.
              I agree in principle, but I'm not so sure you want that authority set at the FEC level. FEC commissioners are appointed by a (partisan) president who typically appoints one GOP, one DEM (in the event two openings come up), but he usually picks someone very close to his own ideology... who is then confirmed by the Senate. Commissioners serve for 6 years at a stretch.

              But I agree with the parts about elections being run by the S of S and districts being drawn by the party in power... those have never made sense to me.

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              • #22
                Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

                Originally posted by noahath View Post
                Minorities tend to be far more disenfranchised, which is why the Supreme Court had to mandate majority-minority congressional districts (which I don't agree with, or support) to ensure they were able to achieve a represenative voice in Congress.
                It seems politicians have figured out how to circumvent these "minority districts". Look into how Alan Grayson managed to sabotage the GOP primary to keep a Hispanic candidate off the ballot so he (one of the whitest white men there is) could get elected.

                It's a disgraceful story of how effectively big money candidates can essentially purchase seats in Congress.

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                • #23
                  Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

                  Originally posted by Good1 View Post
                  I agree in principle, but I'm not so sure you want that authority set at the FEC level. FEC commissioners are appointed by a (partisan) president who typically appoints one GOP, one DEM (in the event two openings come up), but he usually picks someone very close to his own ideology... who is then confirmed by the Senate. Commissioners serve for 6 years at a stretch.

                  But I agree with the parts about elections being run by the S of S and districts being drawn by the party in power... those have never made sense to me.
                  The FEC definitely needs to be overhauled as well. An ideal commissioner is a truly independent one, who has never had an official party registration.

                  Here in Australia, our politicians have zero say in how our elections are run, how our boundaries are drawn, etc. The only say our politicians have in elections is that in the absence of fixed terms, the leader (either the state premier, which is equivalent to a US state governor; or the Prime Minister, can set the date of the election. That's it). Our electoral boundaries are determined solely on the basis of population, not voter patterns, etc. This still means we end up with "safe" seats for one party or another, as where there is a high density of young families, they tend to vote for Labor, where as high income wealthy areas tend to vote for Liberal (which is our conservative party, and not as the name would suggest). The longest I've ever had to wait to vote is about 30 mins, and remember voting is compulsory in Australia, so almost every citizen of 18 or above is out that day voting (we usually get around 7-8% who don't vote, and get fined as a consequence).

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                  • #24
                    Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

                    I mean its one thing to say that politicians work these districts or re-district to give themselves an advantage or whatever. However, to say there are policies by either side to discourage anyone from voting is proposterous. I can see one side not wanting the other side to vote of course, but thats like a baseball team not wanting the other team to score. Well of course they don't, but theres not rules or policies that prevent them. My old address, put my voting precinct in the middle of a sure enough ghetto. Did that stop me from voting, no. Why, because I wanted to vote.
                    If voter ID laws, is suppressing voters, then ID laws are also suppressing, beer drinkers, smokers, lottery ticket buyers, check writers, credit card users, drivers, etc.

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                    • #25
                      Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

                      Originally posted by buck84 View Post
                      I mean its one thing to say that politicians work these districts or re-district to give themselves an advantage or whatever. However, to say there are policies by either side to discourage anyone from voting is proposterous. I can see one side not wanting the other side to vote of course, but thats like a baseball team not wanting the other team to score. Well of course they don't, but theres not rules or policies that prevent them. My old address, put my voting precinct in the middle of a sure enough ghetto. Did that stop me from voting, no. Why, because I wanted to vote.
                      If voter ID laws, is suppressing voters, then ID laws are also suppressing, beer drinkers, smokers, lottery ticket buyers, check writers, credit card users, drivers, etc.
                      Of course they don't want voters to participate. If they really did then elections would be changed to a weekend to encourage greater participation. The reasn elections are held on a Tuesday is because in the late 18th century, farmers used to work weekends, then go to Church on Sunday, then they needed a day to travel to the city to vote, hence Tuesday was set as it was the day that enabled the majority to vote. Back then of course big business wasn't involved in politics so it was all about citizen participation.

                      But parties don't want registered voters of the other party to vote. Of course they don't. It's why in the redistricting process both parties try to coral registered voters from one party into ridiculously shaped districts. Registered Democrats in Pennsylvania vastly outnumber registered Republican voters, so if the majority of registerd Dems voted, the GOP would never wion another state-wide elective office in PA. Both parties will do whatever they can to ensure that their candidates win. Whatever they can.

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                      • #26
                        Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

                        I don't think anything you said, I really disagree with. I'm just saying that suppression of minority voters is proposterous. Minority in the sense of ethinicity, or at the very least, less common than the voter fraud they claim never happens. Besides, at least in my state, not sure about others, I believe you have 2 weeks or so of early voting before the actual election day. I may be wrong on the 2 weeks but its for sure 1 week, but I'm almost certain its at least two. Thats not even counting absentee votes. Damn how much time do you need to cast your vote? That is if you really have full intentions of voting. How much more convenient can it get, short of mobile precincts that come to everyones house?

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                        • #27
                          Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

                          Originally posted by goober View Post
                          So why not have more polling places in urban areas?
                          Why is it that if there is a Republican Secretary of State, urban polling places tend to be few and far between?
                          To my knowledge, the Secretary of State does not define polling places .. this is completely managed by local municipalities within each county, and every metropolitian area (such as a city or town) must give the Board of Elections a list of polling places for each district.

                          That's some conspiracy for a Republican Secretary of State to have that much influence down to a local, small municipality.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

                            Originally posted by MeadHallPirate
                            ahoy Buck84,

                            good job quotin' the mighty New York Times, the mightiest broadsheet in the land!

                            Jim Greer and Charlie Crist Admit Voter Suppression Was Behind Change in Florida Election Laws - NYTimes.com

                            - MeadHallPirate
                            A couple of things that should be noted here:

                            1. The article MHP cites is an opinion piece, not a vetted news article, and
                            2. Greer just pled guilty to 5 felony counts. He's not exactly a reliable source.

                            Now, it would not surprise me to find out that there is some truth to this allegation, but I'd be hard pressed to accept a weather report from Greer (or Christ who is and always was a complete political whore).

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                            • #29
                              Re: Damn Republicans! Constantly Suppressing Voters! Thats a laugh!

                              It might be a fact that Greer said them, but that doesn't make the content factual.

                              Mr. Greer be a cheat, a thief, and a felon. His word is worth less than dog poop.

                              As for Crist, he's trying to curry favor with his new party. And the corroboration of his claims is the word of the aforementioned Mr. Greer.

                              I agree with you that voter suppression exists on both sides. In this instant case, I have a hard time lending any credence to Mr. Greer, for he is an acknowledged major scumbag.

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