Announcement

Collapse

Forum Rules - You must read(Updated!)

DISCLAIMER

You agree to NOT use this site or its affiliated sites, services you may have access to as a result of being a member here (subscriber or otherwise), to post items (images, textual material, etc.) that are pornographic in nature, illegal in the United States and/or the country you reside in, support or encourage illegal activities (e.g., terrorism), advertise for your own personal profit, or send unsolicited messages (i.e. SPAM) to members or non-members.

AND

You agree that if any clause or component of this document is found to not be legally binding in a court of law of proper jurisdiction then the remainder of this document shall remain fully binding and in full force.

AND

You agree to NOT hold Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. (makers of the forum software), uspoliticsonline.com, sites affiliated with uspoliticsonline.com, its administrators, its moderators, others associated with its operation, and its owners liable for any and all of the following (in whole or in part):
Personal insults/attacks by other members.
The content posted by other members, whether directed at you personally or a label/classification you associate with. This includes remarks you consider to be libelous or slanderous in any way.
Any financial or time loss due to your participation here or as a result of something you read at this site, including posts/PMs by other members and feature(s)/software available at the domain uspoliticsonline.com.
The dissemination of any personal information about you as a result of either your negligence (e.g. staying logged into a computer that others have access to) or willingness to post such information on a public and or private forum, private message or chat box. This includes using your real name or other details that could allow other members and/or the general public to determine your true identity. You are prohibited from using your real name on these forums, either as your username or in posts / PMs you write.

FORUM RULES, IN ADDITION TO THE DISCLAIMER

1. These rules apply to all sections of USPOL, including public and private forums, blogs, and visitor messages.

2. You cannot attack and/or personally insult someone. You cannot bait other forum members; this includes referring to posters by derogatory terms. Please, remain courteous and respectful to all forum members at all times. You agree to take responsibility for reporting such posts when you come across them. Please, use the ignore feature if need be. Any member who intentionally and continually posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response, or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion, may be regarded as a “troll” by staff, and have their account suspended or banned.

3. You cannot harass (sexually or otherwise) other members. This includes malicious, slanderous, or defamatory comments. If you are not sure if something you write is inappropriate or not then don't say it. Err on the side of caution.

4. Copying and Pasting Articles, and Starting New Threads. You cannot simply cut and paste in posts or when starting threads. You MUST provide the identifying information (source, author, date, and URL). You must also offer some original thoughts along with the cut and paste. You may copy and paste an excerpt or series of excerpts from the article. Excerpts really shouldn’t be more then a paragraph or two. Furthermore, if you use images or other copyrighted material in your posts or signature you must have permission of the copyright holder unless you know for a fact that the image is in the public domain. In addition:
a. It must include the identifying information; e.g., where available, the author, the publication, the date, the URL.
b. The member must offer some context, including: How did you hear of this article? What is your opinion? Why is it important to you? Why should it be important to forum readers? The more context you provide, the more you assist others in gauging the excerpted information's significance.
c. You may copy and paste an excerpt or series of excerpts, not the whole thing or even the majority of the whole thing to encourage people to read the entire article.

A violation of any of the above will result in the deletion or closing of the post or thread and could earn you a warning or suspension. If you have any questions concering any of the above please PM a moderator and we will be happy to clarify.

5. You cannot post the same thing in multiple forums. You must not open similar threads about the same or a similar topic. You cannot spam the board or send unsolicited messages to members via PM, email or any other means.

6. Do not post off-topic. You cannot derail a thread with off topic posts.

7. You cannot shout in posts. This includes posting in all CAPS, bold, lIkE tHiS, and extra large font. Posts should also be one color, although you may use an additional color for highlighting ideas you wish to address.

8. You may not alter quotes in a way that misrepresents what was originally said.

9. Multiple accounts are not allowed. If you are found to have more than one account all accounts will be permanently terminated.

10. You cannot have a user name, avatar, signature, or post images that are deliberately offensive. That includes the display of overly explicit or graphic images that may not be suitable for minors.

11. Signatures can not have more than three lines of text, with a font size no larger than "4", and no more than two font colors. Images in signatures cannot be any larger than 800 pixels wide x 200 pixels tall. Animated images are not allowed.

12. You are prohibited from taking any action to disturb the use of the services by others, distribute material that contains viruses, spyware or any other malicious code or harmful programs. This includes interfering with the working of the network, attempts to gain unauthorized access to a service or other computer systems that are part of the site or any other site, by use of the available services.

13. Discussion of moderation actions in public and/or private forums is not permitted. Moderation actions include warnings, suspensions and the editing or deletion of posts. If a member has a concern about a moderation action, he or she is invited to address it with the board staff via Private Message. This rule exists to protect the privacy of all posters with regards to disciplinary action. The moderator team will never publicly discuss the warnings/suspensions of any posters, and we ask that you return the favor, whether about yourself or another poster. Posting about moderation actions in the public forums constitutes a violation. You are free to discuss a moderation action via Private Message with the moderator involved, but you may not harass or abuse the moderators (as already specified in the forum rules). In practical terms, this means that once a moderator tells you his or her decision is final, no further PMs about that moderation action are permitted. If you have a concern about a moderation action, you are free to appeal to a Forum Administrator via Private Message. You may only discuss moderator activities or discussion of moderation with staff member if you chose to private message and are not under any circumstances allowed to use the PM function to forward or promote moderator discussion in regards to specific forum action, amongst other regular members. Administrators do reserve the right to read said PMs and may do so ; if that results in discovery of messaging between posters of such moderator discussion then it will lead to the same violation being received for discussing said moderator actions on the forum. If you receive a message to the effect of having been given moderator information, please report it to a member of staff. Engaging back in that discussion with the original violator will earn you just as stiff a sanction.

14. Do not ignore moderators or administrators. Do not repost something a moderator or administrator has deleted. You cannot have moderators or administrators on your ignore list.

15. Only post in English. Short passages in foreign languages may be acceptable if its use seems helpful for the ongoing discussion and when there is no indication of a potential violation of the forum rules. Always provide a translation into English in such cases. In case of doubt, the incident will be regarded as a violation, no matter of the actual meaning of the foreign language text.

16. The use of words/comments etc. written by other posters, without approval of the poster in your personal signature is not allowed nor are references, by name, to other posters allowed.

17. Please pay attention to announcements by Forum staff that will be found in the "Welcome! / News & Announcements" forum from time to time.

18. Use of "liar", "lies", "lying", etc. Accusing someone of being a "liar" or similar accusations towards other posters will generally be regarded as implying an insult and therewith as a violation of the forum rules. "I question the validity of your statement because...", "That's not the truth" or "you are wrong about that" are sufficient for any decent discussion if you want to disagree with somebody's assertions.

19. Thread opening restriction for new members. In order to control SPAM, new members must have moderator approval to start their own threads.

20. Thread titles must relate to the discussion within. Do not make misleading titles, or titles such as "Guess what..." or "You'll never believe this...". Members need to be able to identify the general gist of the thread via the title. Profanity in thread titles is not permitted.

21. Forum members are instructed to use forum tools and abilities for their intended purposes and no other. If members identify a forum glitch or weakness of any kind that allows you to see or do something you know you shouldn't, please report it. Being aware of any unintended access to the Forum and failing to take appropriate steps to notify staff of said access issues, will create a presumption of seeking to take advantage of the issue, will result in either account suspension, or banishment.

22. Any link to a site that contains graphic content, must contain a warning describing what a person might reasonably expect to view if they click on said link. No graphic pictures are to be posted on the Forum.

23. Threats or advocations of violence toward a public figure, or member of the Forum, will not be tolerated. Conversation about revolution or the like is not prohibited by this rule; directly calling for violence is, eg “It's time to kill every <redacted> that voted for the bill,” is not permitted.

24. Accounts with no posts will be deleted after 30 days. Inactive accounts with low post histories may be deleted after one year.

25. Private forums are something offered to members that decide to contribute directly to this site via donations. These donations help immensely in keeping this site up and running. Private forums are designed to allow the contributing member discuss whatever he/she wants to and to have the power to direct that discussion in whatever way he/she chose. They were not designed nor are they intended for simply talking trash about members that don't have access to the forum. While the targeted members cannot see the forum or the comments, it creates a negative atmosphere that really isn't necessary. If you want to totally rip apart ideas, ideologies, political parties, etc. that is fine. We simply ask that you don't use the private forums as a means to attack other members that aren't privy to such comments. It is difficult enough to have a political discussion forum because the discussion of politics is inherently heated as people are so passionate about their beliefs...the ones that take the time to come to such a site in the first place at least. The idea of private forums is so people of similar political persuasions can discuss whatever they want without fear of being attacked. Nonetheless, we hope that a certain level of maturity would foster itself within such an arena and not simply lend itself to a bashing forum.

Private Forums are governed by all of the above Forum rules. In addition:
  • Private forums that essentially become abandoned homes will be subject to deletion, donation or reorganization. Just like elsewhere in life, clubs sometimes lose their vitality and purpose for a myriad of reasons. If it becomes clear that a private forum has clearly lost its vitality and nobody is going to really use it anymore, owners are advised to consider whether to reuse the forum for something new and productive rather than let them linger or notify the Administration that the forum should be rearranged for other purposes, closed, merged with other compatible private forums, donated to others for new purposes, etc. Do not be concerned that your forum must be a membership and post count race with others to avoid falling under this policy; the question is whether your forum has actual vitality instead of being 'brain dead.'
  • Additionally, private forums may only be owned by subscribed members in the Platinum or Diamond categories.
  • Should the owner of a private forum be banned, quit USPOL or otherwise abandon the forum the PF will be transferred to another owner or closed.
  • Propriety of private forums. Administration staff will determine the desirability of a proposed private forum and enact any conditions upon it to ensure its purpose is productive.
  • Any and all instances of sharing accounts by allowing someone else to log in under their own account so they can see into private forums for which they are otherwise not permitted to access, will be deemed violation of the double account rule and all caught doing so will be permanently banned.
  • Relaying private forum posts and information to other posters who are not members of the particular private forum for any negative or destructive purpose (eg mean-spirited gossip, fueling interpersonal disputes, etc), is not permitted, and will constitute a violation of the Forum rules.
  • For purposes of monitoring USPOL Terms of Service Administrative staff (not Moderators) will have access to Private Forums.
  • All Private Forums must have at least one active Administrator as a member for purposes of handling issues which cannot be addressed through moderation permissions.
  • Discussion of moderation activities is prohibited on the open site and is likewise prohibited in Private Forums.

26. The administrators and moderators reserve the right to edit and/or delete a post,and/or close a thread, and/or delete a thread at any time if of the opinion that the post is too obscene, inappropriate, or the discussion has run its course.

27. 'Back seat moderating' is not allowed. If you take issue with another poster's contribution to the forum, you're welcome to report any posts you think are out of line, but you should not bring it up publicly within the forum.

28. Images in posts (whether embedded or hot linked) must be reasonable in size. 800x800 should be considered a good rule of thumb. Excessively large images make it difficult for users on mobile devices to load pages. If necessary please simply link to very large images using the URL tags. In addition, the following images are not permitted (including, but not limited to pages with images or videos containing):
  • Strategically covered nudity
  • Sheer or see-through clothing
  • Lewd or provocative poses
  • Close-ups of breasts, buttocks, or crotches

29. Any solicitation or communication involving sports betting / gambling / online casinos / bookies and or internet based card or slot machine systems or sites will lead to all said content being physically removed from the site and server, and will lead to any and or all parties involved being permanently removed and banned from the site to the farthest extent possible. This includes any links to any form of bookmaker, casino, any type of game or match or event where money transfers on the outcome or link of any sort to wire act violations and or anything in violation of either the Internet Gambling Regulation, Consumer Protection, and Enforcement Act, Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act of 2006, or the Federal wire Act. This applies not only to the open forum but all and or any chat rooms, articles, private messages and or private forums. All content that violates this rule will be deleted, without notice.

CONSEQUENCES

Failure to comply with any of the forum rules may result in your posts being edited or deleted and/or your account being temporarily or permanently banned from the forums. U.S. Politics Online uses a warning system that generates an automated Private Message to members when they are in violation of Forum rules. The decision to issue a warning is left to the discretion of the moderator or administrator handling the violation. If a member does not agree with an action taken by a moderator, they can appeal to an administrator after seeking clarification from the moderator who issued the warning/infraction and appealing to them in the first instance. Members MAY NOT harass a moderator or administrator by sending excessive PMs when they are discussing an appeal.

Violations are assigned a point value. Points are valid for 30 days. When a members earns 10 points, their account will be automatically suspended: five (5) days for a first suspension; ten (10) days for a second suspension; and twenty (20) days for a third suspension. If a member incurs an additional 10 points after having served three periods of suspension, then they will be permanently banned from the Forum.

Point values are as follows:
Zero (0) points – Warning
Two (2) points - Minor infraction / Non post infraction (minor) / Off topic posts / spamming
Four (4) points - Academic dishonesty / Baiting / Discussing moderator or administrator actions / Implying an insult / Minor insults / Moderate infraction / Non-post infraction (moderate) / Thread dumping
Six (6) points - Direct insult at another member / major infraction / Non-post infraction (major)
Ten (10) points - Act of criminality, or advocating thereof

The administrators and moderators also bear the right to issue warnings, temporarily suspend or ban posters for continued trolling or other serious misconduct (eg. professional spamming) even if the poster has not yet reached the maximum warning points or suspensions level. Other options if the above consequences do not seem adequate include placing the member in a moderation queue, which means all posts will have to be approved before they are posted to the board.

PRIVACY POLICY

All information obtained by the end user via the registration process is for internal purposes only and will not be sold to or shared with any third parties. However, if the end user participates in illegal activities and a court of proper jurisdiction orders U.S. Politics Online to release certain information about said user then we will act according to the law. Furthermore, no information will be released on threat of a lawsuit, attempted or actual intimidation, or due to any other reason except as notated in the first sentence of this paragraph. Nonetheless, keep in mind that the information we do have is very limited and generally only consists of the IP address a member uses.

SUBSCRIPTIONS

U.S. Politics Online offers several subscription plans to help cover the operational costs of the site. As a thank you for your donation, you will receive special added benefits meant to enhance your U.S. Politics Online experience. Plans vary in price, starting at only $0.05/day, and benefits vary with the price. Benefits include ability to go straight to new posts, to search the forum, larger avatar, private forums, invisible mode, photo gallery, email, web hosting, and no advertisement banners. Please, click here for more details.
See more
See less

Obamacare, Otherwise Known as The Affordable Care Act (ACA)

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by OldmanDan View Post


    Just what do patents and licenses have to do with the general welfare clause?
    They have to do with "the general welfare of specific individuals as the expense of other specific individuals." If a doctor gets a degree and license, he gets a somewhat exclusive right to practice medicine. Others without that license/degree are not permitted to practice medicine by the government even if patients are willing to go to them. In other words, the government is helping the doctors by arresting their competitors. That's not the free market, that's big government. A pharmacist patents a drug and the government forbids a competitor from producing that same drug and selling it for less. That's not the free market, that's the government's anti-competitive policy.

    These people accumulate great riches all thanks to the government. I don't see too many homeless people who get welfare/medicare driving the same luxury cars or living in the same mansions. So who benefits the most from big government? The answer is self-evident. It's not the poor.

    You are clueless about doctor salaries. I have known many doctors over the years who made less than me and that wasn't millionaire status. They have big incomes but huge expenses.
    Well that's kind of a pointless statement given that we don't know how much you "make." Regardless, I'm not denying that some doctors blow through their earnings by buying mansions and luxury cars. That hardly justifies having the government give them special protections.

    מה מכילות החדשות?


    • Originally posted by Slon View Post

      I wasn't aware he suggested a law that benefits specific individuals by name. As for benefiting some individuals at the expense of others, the US government does this quite a bit with patents and licenses. The rich of this country (such as doctors, lawyers, and patent owners) derive the most benefit from these aspects of the US, but I don't see you railing against these far greater government-made inequalities. The right wingers/"conservatives" generally only emerge to bash the policies that help the common worker (I'm not talking about ACA here, btw). They're MIA when it comes to the big corporations and the worthless rich layabouts that benefit so much from government-created inequalities.

      Granted, the ACA is a disaster and doesn't help the working class very much at all. The real problem is out-of-control doctor and pharmacist salaries, but the anti-competitive government policies that allow them to get rich at the expense of others (sounds familiar?) are still in place.
      It's not the salaries of Doctors and Pharmacist that are out of control, it's the drug companies and insurance companies. They are the ONLY ones profiting inappropriately. On the backs of the ill and those trying to keep healthy. It's not the Doc's that are exploiting the sick, it's the Drug companies and Insurance companies. Follow the money!

      מה מכילות החדשות?


      • Yep, the drug companies are able to charge massively for drugs as can be seen in the difference in price of some medications between the US and Canada or the UK.
        The only reason they charge so much is that they can as the drugs aren't massively cheaper to produce here or in Canada.
        You're being screwed and you have some people who are backing a system that lets them get away with it and it's just amazing.

        Maybe I'm being naive here but I think the vast vast of majority of people who become doctors do so for compassionate reasons and not to make as much money as they possibly can as there are certainly professions that pay more with much less time spent training with the dedt that brings. Blaming hospital staff for inflating health care costs is harsh in the extreme.

        מה מכילות החדשות?


        • Originally posted by msc View Post
          It's not the salaries of Doctors and Pharmacist that are out of control, it's the drug companies and insurance companies.
          Re: drug companies vs pharmacists, you're splitting hairs in a manner that does not matter. A pharmacist can own a drug company.

          As for insurance companies, the doctors are the ones jacking up the prices, even though you may be correct regarding the income of insurance company executives/owners. If doctors/drugs were not so scarce thanks to the government's anti-competitive policies, they wouldn't be able to charge so much. If that were the case, people would not see the average illness or injury to be catastrophically expensive and insurance coverage would not be quite as universal due to fewer people wanting it.

          They are the ONLY ones profiting inappropriately. On the backs of the ill and those trying to keep healthy. It's not the Doc's that are exploiting the sick, it's the Drug companies and Insurance companies. Follow the money!
          I do follow the money. Doctor salaries are quite high.

          מה מכילות החדשות?


          • The Deceptive Salary of Doctors

            http://www.bestmedicaldegrees.com/salary-of-doctors/

            מה מכילות החדשות?


            • Originally posted by Slon View Post
              Re: drug companies vs pharmacists, you're splitting hairs in a manner that does not matter. A pharmacist can own a drug company.

              As for insurance companies, the doctors are the ones jacking up the prices, even though you may be correct regarding the income of insurance company executives/owners. If doctors/drugs were not so scarce thanks to the government's anti-competitive policies, they wouldn't be able to charge so much. If that were the case, people would not see the average illness or injury to be catastrophically expensive and insurance coverage would not be quite as universal due to fewer people wanting it.

              I do follow the money. Doctor salaries are quite high.
              Wrong! Doctors have gone out of business because they can't afford to pay employees and the overhead on the small amounts paid by insurance companies. By some insurance companies our Orthopedist has been paid $36 plus a $20 or $40 copay depending on the insurance. And when there is no copay, he's received less than $50 for follow up visits. On the high end, our pain mgmt. Physician has received up to $57 for a joint injection and $107 for a TPI which involves an injection close to the spine. Some pedicures and all Massages cost more at a spa. We don't take Medicaid because it pays less than $40 for a visit. Our Chiropractor gets paid up to $46 with high end insurance and our physical therapists get paid up to $68 on the high end. Do the math and you'll see that a doctor has to bust there but to make a semi luxurious living. Surgeons, (Orthopedists, Cardiologists, obstetrics, and a couple others), and anastegiolists would be the elites, but it depends on how many surgeries they do. I would say that with the sacrifice of time and money to educate themselves, while paying back hundreds of thousands of dollars of loans after the 20 some years of sacrifice and struggle, they are entitled to live the American dream. That's what hard work gets you in America. Unless of course you're a movie star or politician. You know, the ones in their ivory towers, that say all but themselves are bad if they live in any luxury. Sure a speech or film is worth 250K and 5 to 10 million in one persons pocket, but damn the surgeons that gets paid 35K for an operation. It's the insurance companies and gov't that is getting the excessive money. The docs are getting what they are entitled to and less.

              And sure some pharmacy owners can be living large, as any business owner can be, but the pharmacists are in the same boat as doctors. Insurance companies, Drug companies, are the ones making it big on the backs of hard working citizens.

              מה מכילות החדשות?


              • Originally posted by msc View Post
                Wrong! Doctors have gone out of business because they can't afford to pay employees and the overhead on the small amounts paid by insurance companies. By some insurance companies our Orthopedist has been paid $36 plus a $20 or $40 copay depending on the insurance. And when there is no copay, he's received less than $50 for follow up visits. On the high end, our pain mgmt. Physician has received up to $57 for a joint injection and $107 for a TPI which involves an injection close to the spine. Some pedicures and all Massages cost more at a spa. We don't take Medicaid because it pays less than $40 for a visit. Our Chiropractor gets paid up to $46 with high end insurance and our physical therapists get paid up to $68 on the high end. Do the math and you'll see that a doctor has to bust there but to make a semi luxurious living.
                There's no way to do the math unless we at least know how long each visit takes.

                Surgeons, (Orthopedists, Cardiologists, obstetrics, and a couple others), and anastegiolists would be the elites, but it depends on how many surgeries they do. I would say that with the sacrifice of time and money to educate themselves, while paying back hundreds of thousands of dollars of loans after the 20 some years of sacrifice and struggle, they are entitled to live the American dream. That's what hard work gets you in America. Unless of course you're a movie star or politician. You know, the ones in their ivory towers, that say all but themselves are bad if they live in any luxury. Sure a speech or film is worth 250K and 5 to 10 million in one persons pocket, but damn the surgeons that gets paid 35K for an operation. It's the insurance companies and gov't that is getting the excessive money. The docs are getting what they are entitled to and less.

                And sure some pharmacy owners can be living large, as any business owner can be, but the pharmacists are in the same boat as doctors. Insurance companies, Drug companies, are the ones making it big on the backs of hard working citizens.
                If the insurance companies are getting too much money, whose fault do you think that is? It's the doctors' fault. People wouldn't see the need to buy insurance policies (and it would not become such a big political issue) if doctors didn't charge so much. But they do and the ones "unfortunate" enough to only be upper middle class are reaping the rewards.

                מה מכילות החדשות?


                • Originally posted by Slon View Post
                  There's no way to do the math unless we at least know how long each visit takes.

                  If the insurance companies are getting too much money, whose fault do you think that is? It's the doctors' fault. People wouldn't see the need to buy insurance policies (and it would not become such a big political issue) if doctors didn't charge so much. But they do and the ones "unfortunate" enough to only be upper middle class are reaping the rewards.
                  First not all people find the need to buy medical insurance these days, they are forced to or pay a tax, getting no return when not purchased. A tax for being alive.

                  Doctors do not end up with the amount charged. That's just a fact. And they deserve to live an upper middle class life. And even an elite life in the last half, for all their hard work and high pressure life saving jobs. Jobs where you can not make a mistake or someone will die. So what are you saying, upper middle class should be as high as anyone should get?

                  And I guess there will be no addressing the ridiculous salaries of entertainers, talk show hosts, politicians like Hillary, sports stars, fashion designers, etc. Where's all the anger toward them hogging up all the money.

                  If luxuries exist, who is entitle to them? Luxuries are offered and sold, which also creates jobs for many. Many labor jobs for people that can not make it in the world of technology and jobs that require educational studies. So I guess no one who works hard educationally and can afford luxury is entitle to it. No one should have a house larger than needed or more than 1. No one should personally own a boat unless they need to fish to eat, no more than 1 car per person, and forget about luxury cars. No one should have more cloths or shoes than needed. No one should be able to go on luxurious vacations, etc. And Disney world, where do people get off spending tons of money to go to play in a fantasy world for fun when people are starving in the world. If you make enough money to waste on Disney, then clearly you make too much. So how much is exactly acceptable? Or is it only unacceptable if you're a doctor? How much is too much?

                  People complain about the doctors who have sacrificed a quarter of their life, in time and money, working hard just to get buy, then spend their lives in a high pressure job that requires perfection. Perfection or someone may die. It's just petty and jealous. The elite doctors are entitle to more because they have worked for it and continue working for it.

                  And then you have a presumption that doctors, high pressure living a life of elite luxury and general practitioners who live an upper middle class life don't offer their services to the needy at a minimal cost. They do. And if less money was in the pockets of insurance companies and in the docs pockets, they wouldn't need to collect as much money and would have more time to offer their services to the needy. Besides, the insurance companies and gov't dictates how much a doctor will be paid for services. The docs. can accept it or go out of business. Many doctors that profit big are the ones who work in wealthy area's and only accept cash. Many NYC doctors are now doing this because insurance pays so little. Some now only offer services to the elite, when before they offered it to the average middle class citizen with insurance.

                  And correct me if I'm wrong, (because I may be), but I'm under the impression that doctors were not as elite back in the day when they had to accept the money one could afford to pay, before insurance companies dipped there hand into the field. And even when I was young and insurance was reasonable, I do remember our local doc. making a visit or two to our home when someone was sick and recall him taking 10% opposed to the 20% he was entitled to at many visits. I knew this because my parents openly expressed their appreciation in front of me.

                  I have more faith in people than in our current design of gov't. The more the gov't takes and orchestrated who is allowed to take how much, like all the regulations on doctors and restrictions on monies received, while not putting caps on what insurance companies can charge for premiums, and requirements of how much of the bill they need to cover, and or maximum allowed to leave as a patients co-pay. Why do the insurance companies have free range to profit while trying to control the profit of the doctors?

                  מה מכילות החדשות?


                  • CBO: Obamacare Will Cost US Economy Equivalent of Two Million Jobs

                    ObamaCare will force a reduction in American work hours the equivalent of 2 million jobs over the next decade, Congress’s nonpartisan scorekeeper said Monday. The total workforce will shrink by just under 1 percent as a result of changes in worker participation because of the new coverage expansions, mandates and changes in tax rates, according to a 22-page report released by the Congressional Budget Office (CBO). “Some people would choose to work fewer hours; others would leave the labor force entirely or remain unemployed for longer than they otherwise would,” the agency said in its latest analysis of the now five-year-old law.
                    http://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybens...-jobs-n2091093

                    מה מכילות החדשות?


                    • Originally posted by msc View Post
                      First not all people find the need to buy medical insurance these days, they are forced to or pay a tax, getting no return when not purchased. A tax for being alive.
                      That's a new development. The insurance/doctor prices topic has been going on long before that.

                      Doctors do not end up with the amount charged. That's just a fact. And they deserve to live an upper middle class life. And even an elite life in the last half, for all their hard work and high pressure life saving jobs. Jobs where you can not make a mistake or someone will die. So what are you saying, upper middle class should be as high as anyone should get?
                      You can check out what I said by re-reading my post. I said the salaries are high. You appear to agree, adding that they deserve it.

                      And I guess there will be no addressing the ridiculous salaries of entertainers, talk show hosts, politicians like Hillary, sports stars, fashion designers, etc. Where's all the anger toward them hogging up all the money.
                      Been addressed already.

                      http://www.uspoliticsonline.com/foru...eo-comp-thread

                      If luxuries exist, who is entitle to them? Luxuries are offered and sold, which also creates jobs for many. Many labor jobs for people that can not make it in the world of technology and jobs that require educational studies. So I guess no one who works hard educationally and can afford luxury is entitle to it. No one should have a house larger than needed or more than 1. No one should personally own a boat unless they need to fish to eat, no more than 1 car per person, and forget about luxury cars. No one should have more cloths or shoes than needed. No one should be able to go on luxurious vacations, etc. And Disney world, where do people get off spending tons of money to go to play in a fantasy world for fun when people are starving in the world. If you make enough money to waste on Disney, then clearly you make too much. So how much is exactly acceptable? Or is it only unacceptable if you're a doctor? How much is too much?

                      People complain about the doctors who have sacrificed a quarter of their life, in time and money, working hard just to get buy, then spend their lives in a high pressure job that requires perfection. Perfection or someone may die. It's just petty and jealous. The elite doctors are entitle to more because they have worked for it and continue working for it.

                      And then you have a presumption that doctors, high pressure living a life of elite luxury and general practitioners who live an upper middle class life don't offer their services to the needy at a minimal cost. They do. And if less money was in the pockets of insurance companies and in the docs pockets, they wouldn't need to collect as much money and would have more time to offer their services to the needy. Besides, the insurance companies and gov't dictates how much a doctor will be paid for services. The docs. can accept it or go out of business. Many doctors that profit big are the ones who work in wealthy area's and only accept cash. Many NYC doctors are now doing this because insurance pays so little. Some now only offer services to the elite, when before they offered it to the average middle class citizen with insurance.

                      And correct me if I'm wrong, (because I may be), but I'm under the impression that doctors were not as elite back in the day when they had to accept the money one could afford to pay, before insurance companies dipped there hand into the field. And even when I was young and insurance was reasonable, I do remember our local doc. making a visit or two to our home when someone was sick and recall him taking 10% opposed to the 20% he was entitled to at many visits. I knew this because my parents openly expressed their appreciation in front of me.

                      I have more faith in people than in our current design of gov't. The more the gov't takes and orchestrated who is allowed to take how much, like all the regulations on doctors and restrictions on monies received, while not putting caps on what insurance companies can charge for premiums, and requirements of how much of the bill they need to cover, and or maximum allowed to leave as a patients co-pay. Why do the insurance companies have free range to profit while trying to control the profit of the doctors?
                      What are you arguing against exactly? I thought you agreed with me (see above).

                      מה מכילות החדשות?


                      • Originally posted by Slon View Post
                        That's a new development. The insurance/doctor prices topic has been going on long before that.You can check out what I said by re-reading my post. I said the salaries are high. You appear to agree, adding that they deserve it.Been addressed already.

                        http://www.uspoliticsonline.com/foru...eo-comp-thread

                        What are you arguing against exactly? I thought you agreed with me (see above).

                        Even if someone agreed with you you would argue with them about it.

                        מה מכילות החדשות?


                        • Originally posted by Slon View Post
                          That's a new development. The insurance/doctor prices topic has been going on long before that.You can check out what I said by re-reading my post. I said the salaries are high. You appear to agree, adding that they deserve it.Been addressed already.

                          http://www.uspoliticsonline.com/foru...eo-comp-thread

                          What are you arguing against exactly? I thought you agreed with me (see above).
                          I'm arguing that *not all doctors are ultra elites and do not receive the money being charged.
                          *It's not the doctors that have driven up the charges of medical services to a seemingly unreasonable price, it's the insurance companies and gov't orchestration of the medical field.
                          *Doctors that do appear to have excessive and some that do have excessive monies deserve it more than people in many other fields that breed elites.
                          *And yes, I see you introduced a thread to me from 2011. I wasn't on this forum them so it's understandable as to why I didn't see it. When I read it, perhaps then I'll comment on it.

                          So I guess I could be mistaken about the intent of your post. So if my debating points are not opposing what you've said, then consider my response an endorsement and continuation of your post.

                          מה מכילות החדשות?


                          • Originally posted by msc View Post
                            I'm arguing that *not all doctors are ultra elites and do not receive the money being charged.
                            Did I dispute that?

                            *It's not the doctors that have driven up the charges of medical services to a seemingly unreasonable price, it's the insurance companies and gov't orchestration of the medical field.
                            Isn't that what I said about the government?

                            the US government does this quite a bit with patents and licenses. The rich of this country (such as doctors, lawyers, and patent owners) derive the most benefit from these aspects of the US, but I don't see you railing against these far greater government-made inequalities

                            *Doctors that do appear to have excessive and some that do have excessive monies deserve it more than people in many other fields that breed elites.
                            That is a counterargument to...what comment made by me?

                            *And yes, I see you introduced a thread to me from 2011. I wasn't on this forum them so it's understandable as to why I didn't see it. When I read it, perhaps then I'll comment on it.
                            Did I ask you to resurrect an ancient thread? All I did was point out that I did in fact complain about those other items in the past.

                            So I guess I could be mistaken about the intent of your post. So if my debating points are not opposing what you've said, then consider my response an endorsement and continuation of your post.

                            מה מכילות החדשות?


                            • Originally posted by Slon View Post
                              Did I dispute that?Isn't that what I said about the government?

                              the US government does this quite a bit with patents and licenses. The rich of this country (such as doctors, lawyers, and patent owners) derive the most benefit from these aspects of the US, but I don't see you railing against these far greater government-made inequalitiesThat is a counterargument to...what comment made by me?Did I ask you to resurrect an ancient thread? All I did was point out that I did in fact complain about those other items in the past.
                              So I guess I could be mistaken about the intent of your post. So if my debating points are not opposing what you've said, then consider my response and endorsement and continuation of your post.

                              מה מכילות החדשות?


                              • Repeal this fraud, this "law" AND it's creator !! ... who is also a fraud

                                "If you like your Dr. ... if you like your plan.." blah blah blah - all lies.

                                The liar in chief and his retarded ideas need to be gone !!

                                ----------------------------------

                                Saturday January 02, 2016

                                We 'Owe it' to Americans to Repeal Obamacare

                                Next week, Congress will send a bill to the White House in hopes of repealing Obamacare and defunding Planned Parenthood next week, and Rep Vicky Hartzler said in Saturday's GOP address that the president will need to make some important decisions.

                                "We owe it to the American people to take our best shot at repealing Obamacare, and that’s what we’ll do next week,” the Missouri Republican said. "As a result, President [Barack] Obama will soon have a choice: Does he support the people and women’s health, or does he support Washington mandates and tax dollars going to Planned Parenthood?"

                                ....

                                ....the problem with Obamacare," Hartzler said. "It forces people to buy insurance that’s much more expensive than what they need. And when you force millions of people to buy expensive and unaffordable insurance, it’s not that surprising to see premiums going up."
                                [ jobs disappearing too ]

                                Deductibles are rising too, and Americans are losing their doctors and can't find a good insurance plan.

                                "If we want to make health insurance more affordable, we should make insurance companies compete for your business," she said. "That means we should not force people to buy insurance. It means the exact opposite. Our bill addresses this injustice by eliminating the core of Obamacare: It repeals the individual mandate."


                                ....

                                http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/gop.../02/id/707871/

                                מה מכילות החדשות?

                                Working...
                                X