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Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

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  • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

    Originally posted by goober View Post
    I haven't seen it, but based on your recommendation, I ordered it.

    The thing is this is a media driven culture, and the media has decided that gay is OK, (probably due to the large number of gay people in the media), and they have turned it around in a way that is breathtaking in it's scope.
    A guy like Harvey Milk worked for years to improve things, the movie Milk probably changed more opinions in it's first week than the actual Harvey Milk did in his entire life.
    Will and Grace exposed people to gay characters who were witty and charming, and human, week after week, they became family members, and that made gay normal for tens of millions of people. And that's the kind of opinion change that is nearly impossible to reverse.
    Up until very recently a person could speak against gay rights without risking any animus or stigma from the public, but that's not true anymore.
    People are starting to see those who oppose gay rights in a negative light, not as bad as someone espousing racist views, but the tipping point has been reached, and what was "prevailing wisdom" has become "controversial" on it's way to becoming "stupid" and then "evil".

    What amazes me, is that there are people who seem smart enough to understand the cultural shift that is happening, but still come down on the side of what will soon be stupid and then evil, as though they can make a difference, as though they can come up with an argument that will turn it all around, and then when their argument comes, it's remarkable for the complete lack of imagination or creativity. DO they believe that telling people "it's in the Bible" is going to work? DO they imagine that "But they can't have a baby" is going to stop marriage equality?
    Do they realize that they are modeling the caricatures that will be ridiculed and scorned within their lifetimes?
    I agree with everything you say but would only like to add that it is a reciprocal relationship. Those movies and tv shows could not have been made if people had not already been bravely coming out in times when it was difficult and even dangerous to do so, and more people came out because those tv shows and movies were made.

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    • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

      Originally posted by OldmanDan View Post
      And I am sure there are those out there who believe the same for pedophilia and bestiality.
      I'm sure there may be... But I doubt that society will ever view the victimization of children and animals as harmless. Do you? Honestly, I can't be bothered to debate with someone willing to stoop to comparing homosexuals to victimizers of children and animals. The difference between the two should be clear to any thinking person.

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      • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

        Originally posted by OldmanDan View Post
        The fact is, until recently in history, homosexual activity was considered a perversion. If we accept a change in that belief, why should we not accept changes in other beliefs concerning perversions such as pedophilia or bestiality. There are groups out there professing this very change now.
        While I believe homosexuality is immoral I have to disagree with this statement. Homosexuality has seen many ups and downs throughout human history. Additionally, this varies from culture to culture where some cultures even revered homosexuality in some manner. Off the top of my head I can think of this.

        Sacred Band of Thebes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
        Last edited by fishjoel; 08-06-2012, 07:17 PM.

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        • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

          Originally posted by goober View Post
          What amazes me, is that there are people who seem smart enough to understand the cultural shift that is happening, but still come down on the side of what will soon be stupid and then evil, as though they can make a difference, as though they can come up with an argument that will turn it all around, and then when their argument comes, it's remarkable for the complete lack of imagination or creativity. DO they believe that telling people "it's in the Bible" is going to work? DO they imagine that "But they can't have a baby" is going to stop marriage equality?
          Do they realize that they are modeling the caricatures that will be ridiculed and scorned within their lifetimes?
          What does creativity have to do with it? I don't personally have an issue with homosexuality but, as a Christian, I believe it is clearly immoral. Whether other people buy into that is really completely irrelevant. Also, just because things are culturally popular does not mean it is right. There are many examples of where the culturally popular thing was quite clearly wrong.

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          • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

            Originally posted by Unique POV View Post
            Chemical imbalances cause many things... not all of them mental illnesses. A mental illness is usually considered something that prevents a person from functioning normally in society and/or private relationships. If a person can maintain long term successful employment, and long term successful relationships.. there is no basis to say that they are mentally ill.
            There are various degrees of mental illnesses. I don't think functionality really has much to do with it. There are plenty of people who function normally that have some form of mental illness.

            But hey... just for shits and giggles... let's just say that I am crazy as a loon, as you say I am, despite my very average Jane life of working every day for all of my adult life, paying my mortgage every month, having loving long term relationships with my family, friends and partner... etc. I'm just batshit crazy, as you say I am, because I love a woman instead of a man. In this country do we deny rights to people because of their mental illness if that illness does not cause them to be a danger to themselves and others?
            I never said you were "batshit crazy". Why don't you address what I've actually said instead of resorting to hyperbole? I believe some homosexuals are born the way they are and this could be due to any number of reasons (eg. chemical imbalance, developmental issues, gene mutation). This mental illness has basically the sole effect of causing someone to be attracted to the same gender. That's about it. I don't see that as a horrible or hateful statement.

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            • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

              Originally posted by fishjoel View Post
              There are various degrees of mental illnesses. I don't think functionality really has much to do with it. There are plenty of people who function normally that have some form of mental illness.



              I never said you were "batshit crazy". Why don't you address what I've actually said instead of resorting to hyperbole? I believe some homosexuals are born the way they are and this could be due to any number of reasons (eg. chemical imbalance, developmental issues, gene mutation). This mental illness has basically the sole effect of causing someone to be attracted to the same gender. That's about it. I don't see that as a horrible or hateful statement.
              Pardon me for taking offense at being told I am mentally ill. I'm sure you'd be able to take that insult with much more grace. So tell me now... is it a mental illness or is it immoral? I've just seen you take both positions in a matter of mere moments. BTW... Left handedness was once considered a mental illness too.

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              • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

                Originally posted by Unique POV View Post
                Pardon me for taking offense at being told I am mentally ill. I'm sure you'd be able to take that insult with much more grace. So tell me now... is it a mental illness or is it immoral? I've just seen you take both positions in a matter of mere moments. BTW... Left handedness was once considered a mental illness too.
                I believe homosexual acts are immoral.

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                • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

                  Originally posted by fishjoel View Post
                  I believe homosexual acts are immoral.
                  You and I both, but we don't get the luxury that libs have of writing their own moral code and changing it at will.

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                  • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

                    Originally posted by JohnLocke View Post
                    Do you believe people who behave differently should be treated the same? I mean if a heavy White male in a sleeveless tee shirt commits mass murder, should the treatment of him be the same as a thin, Black female wearing a tee shirt with sleeves who jay walked?
                    Originally posted by Unique POV View Post
                    A same sex couple is the same as an opposite sex couple. The only difference is that they can't accidentally have a baby.
                    Opposite is the same as same? LOL

                    Originally posted by JohnLocke View Post
                    That does not answer my question but that is a BIG difference that you call the same since they cannot deliberately have a baby the normal way either.
                    Originally posted by Unique POV View Post
                    (2) A complete non sequitor unless you also advocate banning marriage between opposite sex couples who can not have children without alternative means.
                    Bringing up banning marriage to same sex couples is the complete non sequitor. You are the one who brought up sexuality as a means to NOT answer the question.
                    Do you believe people who behave differently should be treated the same?

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                    • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

                      Originally posted by Unique POV View Post
                      (1) A personal opinion of yours that (A) has no bearing on the law and (B) is not shared by any reputable member of the mental health community.
                      A factual statement of mine based upon the fact that homosexuals account for such a small percentage of humanity that they in no logical way can be considered normal.
                      Originally posted by Unique POV View Post
                      (2) A complete non sequitor unless you also advocate banning marriage between opposite sex couples who can not have children without alternative means.
                      Not even close. I was pointing out the flaw in YOUR statement.

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                      • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

                        Originally posted by HonorsDaddy View Post
                        A factual statement of mine based upon the fact that homosexuals account for such a small percentage of humanity that they in no logical way can be considered normal.
                        In a statistics class, they would be called a statistical anomaly.

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                        • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

                          Originally posted by OldmanDan View Post
                          You and I both, but we don't get the luxury that libs have of writing their own moral code and changing it at will.
                          But cons do get the luxury of basing their morals on irrational Bronze Age tribal superstitions and magical thinking about sky fairies.

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                          • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

                            Originally posted by HonorsDaddy View Post
                            A factual statement of mine based upon the fact that homosexuals account for such a small percentage of humanity that they in no logical way can be considered normal.

                            ...
                            So since white people account for such a small percentage of humanity, they can in no logical way be considered normal?

                            Those who prefer beer to ale?
                            Cigarette smokers, bowlers, all are small subsets of humanity, so you consider none of them normal?
                            The normal form of life on earth is bacteria.
                            Maybe you want to try a different definition of "normal".
                            Last edited by goober; 08-07-2012, 08:25 AM.

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                            • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

                              Originally posted by goober View Post
                              So since white people account for such a small percentage of humanity, they can in no logical way be considered normal?
                              Depending upon where they are in the world, no they are not normal. In some areas, Australia for example, , yes, being white is the norm and even having a tan stands out like a turd in a punch bowl. In others, like Zimbabwe, you could easily be the one white guy for 100 miles, so no, you're not the norm.

                              As far as humanity, whites account for a bit more than 2%, but are certainly a minority in general.

                              Racial makeup however is not usually defined in terms of normal or abnormal.

                              Behavior, on the other hand, is. A behavior in which less than 2% of the entire human population engages is by definition abnormal. Sorry there are some homosexuals who find the use of plain and accurate language to be offensive, but that really is not my problem.

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                              • Re: Cities seeking to ban Chick-Fil-A?

                                Originally posted by Mr. Crumbles! View Post
                                But cons do get the luxury of basing their morals on irrational Bronze Age tribal superstitions and magical thinking about sky fairies.
                                Uh - no. Has nothing to do with being conservative. Most of humanity is religious in one way or another, and morals seem to be pretty much the same from one culture to the next.

                                I've always wondered why atheists display such a hatred of religion while the religious merely look at atheists and for the most part, don't care what you believe or don't.

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