Announcement

Collapse

Forum Rules - You must read(Updated!)

DISCLAIMER

You agree to NOT use this site or its affiliated sites, services you may have access to as a result of being a member here (subscriber or otherwise), to post items (images, textual material, etc.) that are pornographic in nature, illegal in the United States and/or the country you reside in, support or encourage illegal activities (e.g., terrorism), advertise for your own personal profit, or send unsolicited messages (i.e. SPAM) to members or non-members.

AND

You agree that if any clause or component of this document is found to not be legally binding in a court of law of proper jurisdiction then the remainder of this document shall remain fully binding and in full force.

AND

You agree to NOT hold Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. (makers of the forum software), uspoliticsonline.com, sites affiliated with uspoliticsonline.com, its administrators, its moderators, others associated with its operation, and its owners liable for any and all of the following (in whole or in part):
Personal insults/attacks by other members.
The content posted by other members, whether directed at you personally or a label/classification you associate with. This includes remarks you consider to be libelous or slanderous in any way.
Any financial or time loss due to your participation here or as a result of something you read at this site, including posts/PMs by other members and feature(s)/software available at the domain uspoliticsonline.com.
The dissemination of any personal information about you as a result of either your negligence (e.g. staying logged into a computer that others have access to) or willingness to post such information on a public and or private forum, private message or chat box. This includes using your real name or other details that could allow other members and/or the general public to determine your true identity. You are prohibited from using your real name on these forums, either as your username or in posts / PMs you write.

FORUM RULES, IN ADDITION TO THE DISCLAIMER

1. These rules apply to all sections of USPOL, including public and private forums, blogs, and visitor messages.

2. You cannot attack and/or personally insult someone. You cannot bait other forum members; this includes referring to posters by derogatory terms. Please, remain courteous and respectful to all forum members at all times. You agree to take responsibility for reporting such posts when you come across them. Please, use the ignore feature if need be. Any member who intentionally and continually posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response, or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion, may be regarded as a troll by staff, and have their account suspended or banned.

3. You cannot harass (sexually or otherwise) other members. This includes malicious, slanderous, or defamatory comments. If you are not sure if something you write is inappropriate or not then don't say it. Err on the side of caution.

4. Copying and Pasting Articles, and Starting New Threads. You cannot simply cut and paste in posts or when starting threads. You MUST provide the identifying information (source, author, date, and URL). You must also offer some original thoughts along with the cut and paste. You may copy and paste an excerpt or series of excerpts from the article. Excerpts really shouldnt be more then a paragraph or two. Furthermore, if you use images or other copyrighted material in your posts or signature you must have permission of the copyright holder unless you know for a fact that the image is in the public domain. In addition:
a. It must include the identifying information; e.g., where available, the author, the publication, the date, the URL.
b. The member must offer some context, including: How did you hear of this article? What is your opinion? Why is it important to you? Why should it be important to forum readers? The more context you provide, the more you assist others in gauging the excerpted information's significance.
c. You may copy and paste an excerpt or series of excerpts, not the whole thing or even the majority of the whole thing to encourage people to read the entire article.

A violation of any of the above will result in the deletion or closing of the post or thread and could earn you a warning or suspension. If you have any questions concering any of the above please PM a moderator and we will be happy to clarify.

5. You cannot post the same thing in multiple forums. You must not open similar threads about the same or a similar topic. You cannot spam the board or send unsolicited messages to members via PM, email or any other means.

6. Do not post off-topic. You cannot derail a thread with off topic posts.

7. You cannot shout in posts. This includes posting in all CAPS, bold, lIkE tHiS, and extra large font. Posts should also be one color, although you may use an additional color for highlighting ideas you wish to address.

8. You may not alter quotes in a way that misrepresents what was originally said.

9. Multiple accounts are not allowed. If you are found to have more than one account all accounts will be permanently terminated.

10. You cannot have a user name, avatar, signature, or post images that are deliberately offensive. That includes the display of overly explicit or graphic images that may not be suitable for minors.

11. Signatures can not have more than three lines of text, with a font size no larger than "4", and no more than two font colors. Images in signatures cannot be any larger than 800 pixels wide x 200 pixels tall. Animated images are not allowed.

12. You are prohibited from taking any action to disturb the use of the services by others, distribute material that contains viruses, spyware or any other malicious code or harmful programs. This includes interfering with the working of the network, attempts to gain unauthorized access to a service or other computer systems that are part of the site or any other site, by use of the available services.

13. Discussion of moderation actions in public and/or private forums is not permitted. Moderation actions include warnings, suspensions and the editing or deletion of posts. If a member has a concern about a moderation action, he or she is invited to address it with the board staff via Private Message. This rule exists to protect the privacy of all posters with regards to disciplinary action. The moderator team will never publicly discuss the warnings/suspensions of any posters, and we ask that you return the favor, whether about yourself or another poster. Posting about moderation actions in the public forums constitutes a violation. You are free to discuss a moderation action via Private Message with the moderator involved, but you may not harass or abuse the moderators (as already specified in the forum rules). In practical terms, this means that once a moderator tells you his or her decision is final, no further PMs about that moderation action are permitted. If you have a concern about a moderation action, you are free to appeal to a Forum Administrator via Private Message. You may only discuss moderator activities or discussion of moderation with staff member if you chose to private message and are not under any circumstances allowed to use the PM function to forward or promote moderator discussion in regards to specific forum action, amongst other regular members. Administrators do reserve the right to read said PMs and may do so ; if that results in discovery of messaging between posters of such moderator discussion then it will lead to the same violation being received for discussing said moderator actions on the forum. If you receive a message to the effect of having been given moderator information, please report it to a member of staff. Engaging back in that discussion with the original violator will earn you just as stiff a sanction.

14. Do not ignore moderators or administrators. Do not repost something a moderator or administrator has deleted. You cannot have moderators or administrators on your ignore list.

15. Only post in English. Short passages in foreign languages may be acceptable if its use seems helpful for the ongoing discussion and when there is no indication of a potential violation of the forum rules. Always provide a translation into English in such cases. In case of doubt, the incident will be regarded as a violation, no matter of the actual meaning of the foreign language text.

16. The use of words/comments etc. written by other posters, without approval of the poster in your personal signature is not allowed nor are references, by name, to other posters allowed.

17. Please pay attention to announcements by Forum staff that will be found in the "Welcome! / News & Announcements" forum from time to time.

18. Use of "liar", "lies", "lying", etc. Accusing someone of being a "liar" or similar accusations towards other posters will generally be regarded as implying an insult and therewith as a violation of the forum rules. "I question the validity of your statement because...", "That's not the truth" or "you are wrong about that" are sufficient for any decent discussion if you want to disagree with somebody's assertions.

19. Thread opening restriction for new members. In order to control SPAM, new members must have moderator approval to start their own threads.

20. Thread titles must relate to the discussion within. Do not make misleading titles, or titles such as "Guess what..." or "You'll never believe this...". Members need to be able to identify the general gist of the thread via the title. Profanity in thread titles is not permitted.

21. Forum members are instructed to use forum tools and abilities for their intended purposes and no other. If members identify a forum glitch or weakness of any kind that allows you to see or do something you know you shouldn't, please report it. Being aware of any unintended access to the Forum and failing to take appropriate steps to notify staff of said access issues, will create a presumption of seeking to take advantage of the issue, will result in either account suspension, or banishment.

22. Any link to a site that contains graphic content, must contain a warning describing what a person might reasonably expect to view if they click on said link. No graphic pictures are to be posted on the Forum.

23. Threats or advocations of violence toward a public figure, or member of the Forum, will not be tolerated. Conversation about revolution or the like is not prohibited by this rule; directly calling for violence is, eg It's time to kill every <redacted> that voted for the bill, is not permitted.

24. Accounts with no posts will be deleted after 30 days. Inactive accounts with low post histories may be deleted after one year.

25. Private forums are something offered to members that decide to contribute directly to this site via donations. These donations help immensely in keeping this site up and running. Private forums are designed to allow the contributing member discuss whatever he/she wants to and to have the power to direct that discussion in whatever way he/she chose. They were not designed nor are they intended for simply talking trash about members that don't have access to the forum. While the targeted members cannot see the forum or the comments, it creates a negative atmosphere that really isn't necessary. If you want to totally rip apart ideas, ideologies, political parties, etc. that is fine. We simply ask that you don't use the private forums as a means to attack other members that aren't privy to such comments. It is difficult enough to have a political discussion forum because the discussion of politics is inherently heated as people are so passionate about their beliefs...the ones that take the time to come to such a site in the first place at least. The idea of private forums is so people of similar political persuasions can discuss whatever they want without fear of being attacked. Nonetheless, we hope that a certain level of maturity would foster itself within such an arena and not simply lend itself to a bashing forum.

Private Forums are governed by all of the above Forum rules. In addition:
  • Private forums that essentially become abandoned homes will be subject to deletion, donation or reorganization. Just like elsewhere in life, clubs sometimes lose their vitality and purpose for a myriad of reasons. If it becomes clear that a private forum has clearly lost its vitality and nobody is going to really use it anymore, owners are advised to consider whether to reuse the forum for something new and productive rather than let them linger or notify the Administration that the forum should be rearranged for other purposes, closed, merged with other compatible private forums, donated to others for new purposes, etc. Do not be concerned that your forum must be a membership and post count race with others to avoid falling under this policy; the question is whether your forum has actual vitality instead of being 'brain dead.'
  • Additionally, private forums may only be owned by subscribed members in the Platinum or Diamond categories.
  • Should the owner of a private forum be banned, quit USPOL or otherwise abandon the forum the PF will be transferred to another owner or closed.
  • Propriety of private forums. Administration staff will determine the desirability of a proposed private forum and enact any conditions upon it to ensure its purpose is productive.
  • Any and all instances of sharing accounts by allowing someone else to log in under their own account so they can see into private forums for which they are otherwise not permitted to access, will be deemed violation of the double account rule and all caught doing so will be permanently banned.
  • Relaying private forum posts and information to other posters who are not members of the particular private forum for any negative or destructive purpose (eg mean-spirited gossip, fueling interpersonal disputes, etc), is not permitted, and will constitute a violation of the Forum rules.
  • For purposes of monitoring USPOL Terms of Service Administrative staff (not Moderators) will have access to Private Forums.
  • All Private Forums must have at least one active Administrator as a member for purposes of handling issues which cannot be addressed through moderation permissions.
  • Discussion of moderation activities is prohibited on the open site and is likewise prohibited in Private Forums.

26. The administrators and moderators reserve the right to edit and/or delete a post,and/or close a thread, and/or delete a thread at any time if of the opinion that the post is too obscene, inappropriate, or the discussion has run its course.

27. 'Back seat moderating' is not allowed. If you take issue with another poster's contribution to the forum, you're welcome to report any posts you think are out of line, but you should not bring it up publicly within the forum.

28. Images in posts (whether embedded or hot linked) must be reasonable in size. 800x800 should be considered a good rule of thumb. Excessively large images make it difficult for users on mobile devices to load pages. If necessary please simply link to very large images using the URL tags. In addition, the following images are not permitted (including, but not limited to pages with images or videos containing):
  • Strategically covered nudity
  • Sheer or see-through clothing
  • Lewd or provocative poses
  • Close-ups of breasts, buttocks, or crotches

29. Any solicitation or communication involving sports betting / gambling / online casinos / bookies and or internet based card or slot machine systems or sites will lead to all said content being physically removed from the site and server, and will lead to any and or all parties involved being permanently removed and banned from the site to the farthest extent possible. This includes any links to any form of bookmaker, casino, any type of game or match or event where money transfers on the outcome or link of any sort to wire act violations and or anything in violation of either the Internet Gambling Regulation, Consumer Protection, and Enforcement Act, Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act of 2006, or the Federal wire Act. This applies not only to the open forum but all and or any chat rooms, articles, private messages and or private forums. All content that violates this rule will be deleted, without notice.

CONSEQUENCES

Failure to comply with any of the forum rules may result in your posts being edited or deleted and/or your account being temporarily or permanently banned from the forums. U.S. Politics Online uses a warning system that generates an automated Private Message to members when they are in violation of Forum rules. The decision to issue a warning is left to the discretion of the moderator or administrator handling the violation. If a member does not agree with an action taken by a moderator, they can appeal to an administrator after seeking clarification from the moderator who issued the warning/infraction and appealing to them in the first instance. Members MAY NOT harass a moderator or administrator by sending excessive PMs when they are discussing an appeal.

Violations are assigned a point value. Points are valid for 30 days. When a members earns 10 points, their account will be automatically suspended: five (5) days for a first suspension; ten (10) days for a second suspension; and twenty (20) days for a third suspension. If a member incurs an additional 10 points after having served three periods of suspension, then they will be permanently banned from the Forum.

Point values are as follows:
Zero (0) points Warning
Two (2) points - Minor infraction / Non post infraction (minor) / Off topic posts / spamming
Four (4) points - Academic dishonesty / Baiting / Discussing moderator or administrator actions / Implying an insult / Minor insults / Moderate infraction / Non-post infraction (moderate) / Thread dumping
Six (6) points - Direct insult at another member / major infraction / Non-post infraction (major)
Ten (10) points - Act of criminality, or advocating thereof

The administrators and moderators also bear the right to issue warnings, temporarily suspend or ban posters for continued trolling or other serious misconduct (eg. professional spamming) even if the poster has not yet reached the maximum warning points or suspensions level. Other options if the above consequences do not seem adequate include placing the member in a moderation queue, which means all posts will have to be approved before they are posted to the board.

PRIVACY POLICY

All information obtained by the end user via the registration process is for internal purposes only and will not be sold to or shared with any third parties. However, if the end user participates in illegal activities and a court of proper jurisdiction orders U.S. Politics Online to release certain information about said user then we will act according to the law. Furthermore, no information will be released on threat of a lawsuit, attempted or actual intimidation, or due to any other reason except as notated in the first sentence of this paragraph. Nonetheless, keep in mind that the information we do have is very limited and generally only consists of the IP address a member uses.

SUBSCRIPTIONS

U.S. Politics Online offers several subscription plans to help cover the operational costs of the site. As a thank you for your donation, you will receive special added benefits meant to enhance your U.S. Politics Online experience. Plans vary in price, starting at only $0.05/day, and benefits vary with the price. Benefits include ability to go straight to new posts, to search the forum, larger avatar, private forums, invisible mode, photo gallery, email, web hosting, and no advertisement banners. Please, click here for more details.
See more
See less

Robert Gates Goes To War

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #61
    Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

    Originally posted by tsquare View Post
    Can't get the glass to your mouth?
    No, keeps missing his mouth with the glass.

    ?


    • #62
      Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

      Originally posted by jpn View Post
      Gates' critique is highly bizarre, almost schizophrenic.

      Per The American Conservative writer, Rod Dreher:


      According to Gates Obama makes the correct assessments, but pisses off Gates anyway because Obama just isn't awed enough by the military's generals. After a decade of pointless war in Afghanistan, it seems to me that being highly critical of the military brass is a no-brainer. Gates wrote: "The president doesnt trust his commander, cant stand Karzai, doesnt believe in his own strategy and doesnt consider the war to be his. For him, its all about getting out.
      Seems to me that displays a pretty good grasp of reality.

      By the way, it's no surprise whatsoever in this conservative haven that the opening post quotes Woodward's hatchet piece. Of all the reviews, Woodward's is by far the most nakedly anti-Obama. Almost every other review is careful to point out that Gates has many good things to say about Obama in his book, but reading the Woodward piece you'd think that Gates thought he was the worst president ever. But that just isn't the case.

      Woodward has had it in for Obama since day one, and I've never understood why.
      The commander in chief sending troops off to a dangerous mission where they'll be killed and maimed, one he doesn't believe in and doesn't support, based on political decisions and political expediency, that's acceptable leadership of the troops now?

      Obama could have out right pulled all troops out from day one.
      Or he could have supported the mission as is.
      Or he could have changed the mission into one that he could support.

      Any of those decision would be far better than to send troops on a mission that he didn't believe in.

      ?


      • #63
        Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

        Originally posted by Commodore View Post
        The fact that Hillary may have been a capable representative of the foreign policy of the Obama administration in and of itself does not make her Presidential material.
        Capable representative of US foreign policy is questionable. Consider:
        • even an admirer must acknowledge that few big problems were solved on her watch. There was no equivalent of Ambassador George F. Kennan's development of the containment doctrine and associated initiatives, such as the creation of NATO during the Cold War; Secretary of State Henry Kissinger's paving the way for the United States' opening to China; or Secretary of State James Baker's push for German reunification after the fall of the Berlin Wall.
        • In the Middle East, the verdict on Clinton is mixed, even leaving aside the very sad but overdebated tragedy in Benghazi. On the positive side, the sanctions regime on Iran has never been stronger. Meanwhile, the Arab Spring brought hope, not only to Libya but also to Egypt and Tunisia; the administration was wise enough not to try to prop up aging autocrats such as Hosni Mubarak when it became evident that they would not survive. It has also been patient in its dealings with Egypt's new president, Mohamed Morsi. Clinton was especially prominent in government decision-making on Libya, even in the face of Pentagon reluctance, but she played a major role in the other cases too.
        • On the negative side, though, U.S. popularity in the region has plummeted back to Bush-era levels. The promise of Obama's June 2009 Cairo speech was generally left unrealized. There has been no movement on the Israeli-Palestinian peace process. The administration failed in its efforts to keep U.S. forces in Iraq past 2011. Syria is still in chaos. Iran continues to enrich uranium and to sponsor mayhem.
        • Yet Clinton should not get off scot-free. On Syria, the United States remains at a loss. The administration's caution has become regrettable and counterproductive in light of the tragedy there. More effective U.S. support for the opposition seems warranted, and there is now a strong case for joint U.S.-NATO-Arab League airstrikes too. In Afghanistan, although more robust engagement and counterinsurgency were preferable to accepting a Taliban defeat, the Obama administration failed to develop a working partnership with President Hamid Karzai or to send successful messages about long-term U.S. plans, and some of Clinton's team contributed to the mixed messaging. That uncertainty led Pakistan to hedge, at times even condoning the insurgency.

        State and the Stateswoman | Foreign Affairs

        And those points are from an ardent Democratic supporter no less. So let's not get carried away on her accomplishments in that role.

        ?


        • #64
          Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

          Anybody notice how the MSM has jumped from the Gates book to the Christie scandal? Like maybe they were saving the Christie thing for just such an occasion.

          ?


          • #65
            Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

            Originally posted by OldmanDan View Post
            Anybody notice how the MSM has jumped from the Gates book to the Christie scandal? Like maybe they were saving the Christie thing for just such an occasion.
            Hmm. Now that you mention it. Wheels within wheels within wheels.

            Anything to get the conversation away from the ObamaCare failure. Anything to damage a potential Republican leader. Yeah, that's our Biased Lame Stream Media at work.

            Let's see if it's still an uproar after 24 more hours.

            ?


            • #66
              Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

              Originally posted by Commodore View Post
              I don't see how that example proves some sort of cultural incompatibility between democracy and inter-war Germany. The Weimar Republic's problems stem largely from external economic forces caused by terms of the Treaty of Versailles and the Great Depression that combined to put a serious hamper on the German standard of living. That drop in the standard of living is what gave Hitler a box to stand on, not a natural German love for a dictator. Put those issues aside and why would Germany have have elected the NAZI party?

              The Japanese people did as their Emperor told. If he had said fight to the last man, women and child, they likely would have. Most of the Generals where still not willing to surrender after Nagasaki. Had the Emperor not gotten on the radio for the first time in history, the order may not have been respected.
              no no no. not a dictator. A STRONG MAN. A strong, high empowered executive was what they favored for their entire history. HRE which was neither holy roman nor an empire had a STRONG executive and a council of sorts (electors) to semi-check him. They liked that. Same with the gov in WW1, really powerful executive with relatively minor checks but checks nonetheless. Then we give them a full on legislature and an executive that had less power than the Queen of England does now. The germans REALLY didn't like that. On top of all the other problems (treaty, depression, post war loss of pride, the rise of nationalism, etc) it made a perfect storm for a strong man to SEIZE total power (as opposed to being handed simply MOST of the power which historically worked out fairly well for the germans), exactly like hitler did with the night of the long knives.
              Its not that they have a love of dictators. Its that they really like to be able to point to one person and say "that dude's fault" and likewise they like to say "this is fucked up YOU fix it" and actually be able to have that done.

              Like I said, they have a culture that respects a leader's will when he says "put your fucking weapons DOWN" as a matter of honor. The afghanis have no such cultural taboo, not that they don't have a concept of "honor" just that their concept isn't so heavily tied to individual leaders saying "we're done guys" or "kill them all". They have a fierce independent streak that the Japanese didn't have as individuals but as a nation. Hence the apples and oranges comparison.

              ?


              • #67
                Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

                Originally posted by noahath View Post
                Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting that; I was referring to some posters who are quick to cite Gates when he criticises Obama. My question was would they also cite Gates when he praises people they don't like?
                Hilary made a damn good sec state, she carried out her orders (shitty as they were) with aplomb. Certainly she did better than Kerry right up to Benghazi. She is a cold, hard nosed bitch. Which is what you need in that position. She works towards others goals quite well.
                Note he didn't say "and I'd vote for her for president" just "she's a good American diplo".

                ?


                • #68
                  Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

                  Originally posted by eohrnberger View Post
                  Hmm. Now that you mention it. Wheels within wheels within wheels.

                  Anything to get the conversation away from the ObamaCare failure. Anything to damage a potential Republican leader. Yeah, that's our Biased Lame Stream Media at work.

                  Let's see if it's still an uproar after 24 more hours.
                  To be fair said republican leader earned it all by his own self. He wanted to play hardball and he left a trail. YES YES I KNOW "it was his aides". Please spare me. Everybody gets up obamas ass (rightly so) about the IRS scandal et al. The buck stops with the boss.
                  Thank god he's a cooked goose now. Wasn't looking forward to that.

                  ?


                  • #69
                    Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

                    Originally posted by OldmanDan View Post
                    Anybody notice how the MSM has jumped from the Gates book to the Christie scandal? Like maybe they were saving the Christie thing for just such an occasion.
                    Well they have to shelve something ha.ha.--the heat on Obama requires 24/7 stories of something/anything else now-a-days--LOL

                    ?


                    • #70
                      Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

                      Originally posted by reality View Post
                      To be fair said republican leader earned it all by his own self. He wanted to play hardball and he left a trail. YES YES I KNOW "it was his aides". Please spare me. Everybody gets up obamas ass (rightly so) about the IRS scandal et al. The buck stops with the boss.
                      Thank god he's a cooked goose now. Wasn't looking forward to that.
                      I never thought a lot of Christie anyway--so no harm done. There are much better candidates out there. We don't need to replace a Chicago Thug with a New Jersey Thug that's for certain.

                      ?


                      • #71
                        Re: Robert Gates Goes To War

                        Originally posted by Oreo View Post
                        I never thought a lot of Christie anyway--so no harm done. There are much better candidates out there. We don't need to replace a Chicago Thug with a New Jersey Thug that's for certain.
                        You can say that again. Not to mention Christie is only popular enough to win (or was rather) in the east.

                        Who are the much better candidates in your opinion?

                        ?

                        Working...
                        X